KelliH and others Banned? Why?

[nicolai]

Nicolai, think before you post as that was the most asinine of comparisons. I don't have the energy to rip that post apart right now.

Griz

Yeah, OK BOB

 

[hill4803]

Nice to see everyone getting along! FAUNA, ONE BIG HAPPY FAMILY!

Mr. pot meet Mr. kettle.
I just have to ask. Jim, why are you still posting? Didn't you just say that if people want the thread to stop they need to stop posting? And why is it that everytime there is a thread with some discord you must inject yourself into the middle & "make phone calls" to each party to get the scoop? You are like the neighbor who has to be in the middle of every neighborhood disagreement. And I just love the smilies you posted after being informed that the site was down. Is that how you really feel? And after you had said you wish Kelli luck with her new website. What a genuine kinda guy. Business kinda slow? Because you sure do spend a lot of time on the forums for a guy who puts a premium on his time. Before you ask, I am on summer break, I have ALL kinds of time.

The word on the new website is that it is a minor issue & the new "live" site will be online shortly. Anyone is welcome to come and see what we are talking about...publicly

 

[nicolai]

This one is just for BOB.

We hold a weekly poker game at my houe. 5 of my fellow coworkers and friends are the regulars at the game. One week one of them was sick so we invited another coworker to play with us. During the course of the evening with all talked about work and the people there and the other coworkers that we didnt get along with. I even made a comment about my supervisor being a jackass for a misunderstanding we had a long time ago which i was still angry about and held resentment towards for what happened. Well unbeknownst to us this new gentleman to the game tape recorded the entire conversation. Upon returning to work the following day he played it for everyone to hear in the cafeteria at lunch time. A lot of our coworkers were hurt and upset by what we said about them even though we were in the privacy of my own home when they said it and never meant for them to hear any of it or to have any of it made public.
Even though I didnt intend on the affected people to ever hear what was said in my house I went and appologized to each of them for hurting thier feelings and also for embarrassing them publically. In the end everyone realized nobody meant any harm and we were all able to coexist and work together as we all have our inner feelings that we keep either to ourselves and our friends.


Is this a better analogy???

 

[Griz]

This one is just for BOB.

We hold a weekly poker game at my houe. 5 of my fellow coworkers and friends are the regulars at the game. One week one of them was sick so we invited another coworker to play with us. During the course of the evening with all talked about work and the people there and the other coworkers that we didnt get along with. I even made a comment about my supervisor being a jackass for a misunderstanding we had a long time ago which i was still angry about and held resentment towards for what happened. Well unbeknownst to us this new gentleman to the game tape recorded the entire conversation. Upon returning to work the following day he played it for everyone to hear in the cafeteria at lunch time. A lot of our coworkers were hurt and upset by what we said about them even though we were in the privacy of my own home when they said it and never meant for them to hear any of it or to have any of it made public.
Even though I didnt intend on the affected people to ever hear what was said in my house I went and appologized to each of them for hurting thier feelings and also for embarrassing them publically. In the end everyone realized nobody meant any harm and we were all able to coexist and work together as we all have our inner feelings that we keep either to ourselves and our friends.


Is this a better analogy???

See Nicholas, I knew with a little bit of thought, you could come up with a better analogy! Your analogy is actually quite good. Now, if the "parties" will step up to the plate and privately offer apologies then the episode dies. The measure of a man, or woman in this case, will be determined not by me but by the parties offended.

Nicholas, let me hand you an analogy.

Say you go into a building that was built in the 1850's. It's beautiful and strong and shows the timeless grace that coincedes with it's age. Yet, if you look up in the rafters you will see the scars from the flickering of fires days gone by. You see, while the building may be beautiful, you can never fully repair the damage that fires have done. Sure, you can shore up the rafters, tuckpoint the mortar, but the damage still survives even if not on the surface. Maybe this analogy might be lost on you but I am sure your coworkers understand it.

Griz

 

[Ken Harbart]

Bullshit. I have to call it.

Everyone here is a bunch of hypocrites. To say that you would/have never spoken about someone else behind their back is a outright lie! You can try to continue to ride the high horse if you all so desire but I think that everyone knows the truth. I know that everyone is going to jump up and down swearing "I NEVER".

Again, bullshit!

Call it all you want Jeremy, but bear in mind that what you have posted does not constitute valid reasoning. I fully realize where you're both coming from and going with it, and do not dispute that, at some time in their lives, nearly everyone has done something similar. However, for most of us that should have been ages ago, and here's why.

The type of behavior and sniping that has taken place is to be expected from adolescent children at best- not adults. There comes a time in one's development that they should mature emotionally. Unfortunately, some people never mature emotionally, and never quite embrace the core value of integrity. It doesn't show in the herp community because those who lack it constantly strive to put themselves front and center out of a desire to somehow seem relevant, but many individuals do indeed possess integrity. The person that you see in those cases is the real deal- no masks, no deceit.

And then we have the truly malicious and spiteful individuals that are amongst the emotionally underdeveloped. These are the few who get sadistic pleasure from their actions and what has transpired. These individuals have no interests whatsoever in any type of solution. Rather, they pride themselves about problems that they can cause and the discord that they can sew. These emotionally underdeveloped and insecure individuals feel the compulsion to try to tear other people down so they can feel better about themselves.

One of these individuals, for instance, brags about how much of a "bitch" she is. Sadly, a character flaw like that isn't even remotely something to be proud of.

 

[bcfos]

Kinda like you are......

Bravo!!! Could not have said it better myself. And being a moderator of a very public forum you are held to a lot higher standards as general members. So pretty much demanding it be public is about the lamest most childish thing I have ever been witness to. Take it private like most people of such moral standing would.

 

[kmurphy]

Nice to see everyone getting along! FAUNA, ONE BIG HAPPY FAMILY!

Mr. pot meet Mr. kettle.
I just have to ask. Jim, why are you still posting? Didn't you just say that if people want the thread to stop they need to stop posting? And why is it that everytime there is a thread with some discord you must inject yourself into the middle & "make phone calls" to each party to get the scoop? You are like the neighbor who has to be in the middle of every neighborhood disagreement. And I just love the smilies you posted after being informed that the site was down. Is that how you really feel? And after you had said you wish Kelli luck with her new website. What a genuine kinda guy. Business kinda slow? Because you sure do spend a lot of time on the forums for a guy who puts a premium on his time. Before you ask, I am on summer break, I have ALL kinds of time.

The word on the new website is that it is a minor issue & the new "live" site will be online shortly. Anyone is welcome to come and see what we are talking about...publicly

So Ro, what hat were you wearing with that post? Fauna's or Gecko's. Are you a little bored because the site is down, or was this thread dying down too much for you? There are plenty on this site that are attempting to let this all go by the wayside. I didn't see any of that over there. It would have been nice to read one thread that showed regret for what took place.

 

[kmurphy]

go by the wayside

Actually that didn't come out right. No one is trying to have this go by the wayside. It happened and hopefully the parties involved will be able to resolve their issues with each other.

 

[Chameleon Company]

Well Nicolai, your logic and mine just ended up in complete lockstep with you post about people needing to take responsibility for their actions and apologizing in public. ! I guess politics can make for strange bedfellows!

This whole "neutrality" and "both sides" things has my you-know-whats all in a knot. I have been vocal about the incident much of the weekend. Like Griz and others, I posted my views into the belly of the beast over there early on. I reached out and tried to engage every player in private. As of last night, I had spoken to on the phone, or in PM, or in email, every major player in this event about this event. I began all from a neutral perspective, as I had no issue with Kelli or Marcia in the beginning. That I have an opinion now of who screwed up, who didn't, and how to fix it, even if just my opinion, is not a sign of any loss of objectivity. Quite the contrary, I think that I am in a position to be as objective as possible, having gotten everyone's $.02. Besides having read all of my posts, Kelli and I spoke about my exact complaints, and those I had from others. Marcia and I by email. Kelli spoke to at least a few others who had issues with her about this, and that is to her credit. Kelli and I spoke of specific remedies. While I doubt that I raised any major point that she had not already read or heard from my posts or from others, we had a very good discussion about the "why's" of much of the remedy, about seeing it from the eyes of others, etc. Despite our positions in this, I happen to think that Kelli and I had no trouble at all in being objective in our discussion. Not all of the "agreed upon" remedies have occurred yet, and I was not the only person to talk remedies with Kelli by any stretch, and Kelli is certainly not beholden to me. But as I stated earlier, with my goal being to minimize a recurrence of something like this, or at least of this scale, in the future, it is why I am a fix things head-on now person, and why I have been as I have here. It absolutely means a bit more discomfort now. While not a guarantee, it is also the best way that I know of to influence future behavior that no one wants to see again.

Ro, talk about knots ! The "smilies" was applauding Kelli for taking what looked like a step in the right direction, in part because she and I had just spoken about it an hour or so prior. Otherwise, the rest of your views come as no surprise. Take a good look at Griz' posts. Then look at yours. One is an effective way to influence, the other is not going to accomplish anything positive, and is remarkable in its similarities to the poorly thought out posts which started this mess. BTW, I placed not a phone call of the four that I had yesterday with particulars in this. They called me, and all were constructive from the start. Sorry to disappoint !

 

[hill4803]

To answer your questions Kevin, I was wearing the same hat I always wear...My Georgia Bulldog hat. And Yes, I am a tad bored, maybe I'll go outside and mow the grass.
And Jim, I am not at all disappointed with your response, disappointment would mean that I had set some sort of expectations for you. The only thing I ever expect from you is just the typical load of garbage you dump on every post. I am not in the least concerned with influencing people on this forum. I am of the belief that people are free to make whatever choices they feel are right for them. You seem to always have a "sales pitch" for your point of view...hence the reason you are still posting more than any other member, including those that have been DIRECTLY affected by the issue...Rich, Lucille, et al.

 

[WebSlave]

I would strongly suggest that everyone here tone down the comments towards each other. I know emotions are running high, but that is not sufficient excuse to be belittling each other. I am trying hard to not dispense too many warning points, but there are limits to what is going to be tolerated here.

 

[Chameleon Company]

Ro, even had my name not been mentioned in that thread by Mods and others from here, I would likely have taken an involvement, as I have other dogs in this hunt. Some of the sniping is disappointing. Some is expected. I believe that site will have much appeal to you, and hope that you are able to post there again soon.

 

[Otter_23]

You must have a lot of dogs. I see them in just about every thread.

 

[dragonflyreptiles]

I would like to add. Even though some of the people in the thread on the other forum are banned, I believe if you email Rich an apology (if thats what you want to do) to signify your remorse over this situation I bet Rich would post it here for you. i know you guys/gals said it wasnt meant for publics eye but it did end up there and peoples feelings were hurt. Intentionaly or not an apology here in my eyes is certainly warrented to make things right. If you were on the opposite side of this you wouldnt expect anything less. Time to step up to the plate and be adults, Even if you have no intention of coming back here for various reasons why leave in this fashion.

Marcia made a public apology on Kellis forum.

I can post it if I am allowed?

 

[varnyard]

Come on guys, the last (I am not gong to count the pages) have been going where? Let it rest until new information is gathered. This fighting back and forth is going no where. There are plenty of hurt feelings, and it is only going to get worse if the bickering continues.

I am going to also say this. I think we all know where we stand, it does not need to be proven time and time again.

So, as I said before, give it a break.

 

[hill4803]

I have no doubt that you would have been involved Jim. You sure do seem to have a lot of "hunting dogs". The new website does appeal to me and I am certain that I will be able to post there again shortly. BTW, were you able to unsubscribe? I know you deem the pettiness of our discussions on that forum to be beneath you.

For those of you who believe that the issue with fauna was ALL that was discussed in that forum or even on that thread, I can assure you there was more discussion about other issues more than some would have you to believe. We actually had many stimulating posts about geckos (and some about snakes too!)

I do hope those DIRECTLY involved in this matter can come to some understanding.

 

[TripleMoonsExotic]

Marcia made a public apology on Kellis forum.

I can post it if I am allowed?

What of your public apology?

 

[bcfos]

What of your public apology?

Steph I am a betting man and I would be willing to bet a couple of like wise apologies will be found in that rather long thread.

 

[Chameleon Company]

Marcia and I have traded several notes in the last few hours. For the record, the apology was not up for very long before the site went down. It is still down. Marcia wanted me to post a copy of it, with permission of course, but was herself unable to retrieve it. What is refreshing is the way that Marcia and Kelli are trying to respond in constructive ways, while other minions are what? You hit the nail on the head Bobby.

 

[hill4803]

Marcia and I have traded several notes in the last few hours. For the record, the apology was not up for very long before the site went down. It is still down. Marcia wanted me to post a copy of it, with permission of course, but was herself unable to retrieve it. What is refreshing is the way that Marcia and Kelli are trying to respond in constructive ways, while other minions are what? You hit the nail on the head Bobby.

Yes, Bobby, you did hit the nail on the head. For once I agree with you Jim.

**I would also like to say for the record: Bobby & I are not related, at least I don't think so...got any relatives in St.Louis?