Luis Taracena (herphobbiest) bad deal

[Junkyard]

Luis, how much is the necropsy costing you? I am curious about what tests they are running specifically and what the result are. It would be interesting if anything shows up in a culture and blood tests, if that is possible after being frozen for so long. Hopefully you did not miss your opportunity to find out what happened to that snake.

 

[HerpHobbiest]

Luis, how much is the necropsy costing you? I am curious about what tests they are running specifically and what the result are. It would be interesting if anything shows up in a culture and blood tests, if that is possible after being frozen for so long. Hopefully you did not miss your opportunity to find out what happened to that snake.

So far I have paid $95.00

That includes several lab test. The Pathologist will preform a Visual necropsy and decide which lab test are needed.

I have heard that once frozen the animal cause of death could not be accurately determinated. Say 75% possiblility instead of beyond the shadow of doubt.

I spoke with the pathologist in duty and he said that there is only a few test that would turn undeterminable. However other test that can be preformed in which he could get the cause of death.

He say some of those thest may have to be preformed at another Lab. but he warn me that there may be other costs.

We will get to the bottom of it !!!

Luis

 

[mdc]

I did say that I will stand behind him. My problem is that you lied to me and told me that you had already taken it to the vet, and then when I requested information over the next few weeks, you ignored my emails. If I hadn't of come here, the snake would still be in your freezer and I would be out of luck.

Matt Crabe

 

[Griz]

I have heard that once frozen the animal cause of death could not be accurately determinated. Say 75% possiblility instead of beyond the shadow of doubt.

If this is the case then the honus is on you, not Matt. If your freezing the snake causes it to where the cause of death cannot be determined then you should be eating all of the costs. Matt did not delay the tests, you did.

Griz

 

[Fedawg]

Luis ,

2 questions.

If you knew that freezing a snake would effect the outcome of the testing , why did you do it?

Also , correct me if Im wrong, but didn't you say in post #39 that you work 12 hours a day ? Do you work on a computer ? How are you posting here?



Derek Federico

 

[HerpHobbiest]

If this is the case then the honus is on you, not Matt. If your freezing the snake causes it to where the cause of death cannot be determined then you should be eating all of the costs. Matt did not delay the tests, you did.

Griz

Griz,

That is what I had heard before I spoke with the Patologist, You know the proffecional that knows...

You must have miss the rest of my post

I have heard that once frozen the animal cause of death could not be accurately determinated. Say 75% possiblility instead of beyond the shadow of doubt.

I spoke with the pathologist in duty and he said that there is only a few test that would turn undeterminable. However other test that can be preformed in which he could get the cause of death.
He say some of those thest may have to be preformed at another Lab. but he warn me that there may be other costs.

We will get to the bottom of it !!!

Luis

Thanks for bringing that up BOB, Now that I have spoken with the professional we all know that freezing is not recommended... Better that let the animal Rot in the cage.... Refrigerating is best!!! But anyways there are ways around it and the professional pathologist can get with other test the exact cause of death.

No hard feelings Bob... A lot of people here only see what they want to see.

Regards, Luis T.

 

[HerpHobbiest]

Luis ,

2 questions.

If you knew that freezing a snake would effect the outcome of the testing , why did you do it?

Also , correct me if Im wrong, but didn't you say in post #39 that you work 12 hours a day ? Do you work on a computer ? How are you posting here?



Derek Federico

Derek,

Because, I did not know before the fact that the snake was already frozen. I did not know where to turn to do a necropsy right away say Saturday 8:00PM. Now I know that there is refrigerated a drop off at the University of Arizona.

I work and everything gets documented in a computer. I should not be playing on-line. However I am wating on equipment to process its 45 minute cycle.

Luis

 

[Neil Gubitz]

You're kidding, right??.... All I see is a SCAMMER, LIAR and a THIEF!!.... You have EXCUSES for everything??.... You SAY you couldn't afford the shipping right AFTER you received the Albino, now you're gonna try to make us believe that you can pay for the necropsy, AND you've already spent $95??....
You want us to believe that the snake is even AT the university??.... Give us the name and number of the place again (which you've done), NOW give us the Case number and WHO the snake is listed under so WE CAN CHECK.... But, of course, I KNOW no Case number will ever be listed here, will it??....

Neil

 

[joepythons]

excuse

Luis ,

2 questions.

If you knew that freezing a snake would effect the outcome of the testing , why did you do it?

Also , correct me if Im wrong, but didn't you say in post #39 that you work 12 hours a day ? Do you work on a computer ? How are you posting here?



Derek Federico

Folks we are now reading his(luis) next excuse!!! Sorry FEDAWG i could not help myself

 

[Dennis Hultman]

I think Neil just about summed it up. I don’t think you ever answered the question, Why did you go through with this deal when you had already lost your job and you knew you couldn’t pay for shipping?

The fact still remains that the BP’s should have shipped immediately after you received your part of the trade. You still had them when this snake passed six weeks later. The problems have all occurred on your end.

What Matt has done- He shipped his snake in good faith.

What he has received in return-

Luis lost his job and can’t ship.
One, two, three, four, five, weeks later, Luis still can’t pay for shipping.
Luis still waiting to ship six weeks later when the snake dies.
Luis now changes the deal. Matt will not receive his part unless the necropsy is favorable to him.

The only right thing to do is to immediately ship your part of the agreement. If and when you do have some results then post them.

 

[Junkyard]

No, "sometimes" the exact cause of death cannot be found with a frozen specimen. Some tissue cells will rupture when the animal is thawed out, under the microscope it is a big mess. I do doubt a culture will produce anything.

 

[esoteric-lizard]

No, "sometimes" the exact cause of death cannot be found with a frozen specimen. Some tissue cells will rupture when the animal is thawed out, under the microscope it is a big mess. I do doubt a culture will produce anything.

i bet that snakes death is secondary to stress... how do we know that snake wasn't cooked, or dehydrated from a parasite infestation (such as from tape worm)? the animal looked to have good weight - even post-mortem!!

it is unlikely an animal of such healthy appearance would suddenly die from an acute case of cancer!!!

i bet that if the snake was taken to the vet at the first signs of sickness the animal would be alive today!

i have done business with Matt C. before... he is very trustworthy and its a shame to see someone jack him like this!!!

 

[esoteric-lizard]

sorry to double post... but after looking at these pics i am 95% sure this snake was cooked.

click here:
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=77100&page=8&pp=5

1st: a snakes muscles relax when hot, that could eplain all the loose feces and urates.

2nd: the snake is in the water bowl as if trying to make a last effort at cooling itself.

3rd: look at the snakes body... it obviously died an uncomfortable death... probably from environmental causes. the only thing that could make a snake contort like that is heat, chemicals, or not being able to breath. if it had died from natural causes, it wouldnt suprise me to see it curled up in a corner, or found under the newspaper.

ok, that is my crack at crime scene investigator.

luis... did you thermostat malfunction?

 

[HerpHobbiest]

You're kidding, right??.... All I see is a SCAMMER, LIAR and a THIEF!!.... You have EXCUSES for everything??.... You SAY you couldn't afford the shipping right AFTER you received the Albino, now you're gonna try to make us believe that you can pay for the necropsy, AND you've already spent $95??....
You want us to believe that the snake is even AT the university??.... Give us the name and number of the place again (which you've done), NOW give us the Case number and WHO the snake is listed under so WE CAN CHECK.... But, of course, I KNOW no Case number will ever be listed here, will it??....

Neil

Dear Neil...

Please re-read post # 79

The Snake is in Tucson at the University of Arizona
Departament of Veterinary Science and Microbiology
2831N Freeway
Tucson, AZ 85705-5021
Phone 520 621 2356
Case # 06-2003

I knew an a-hole would come up ...so I save these pictures.

No hard feelings Neil... No need to apologize for calling me a SCAMMER, LIAR and a THIEF!!.... You have EXCUSES for everything??.... Because I just called you an A-Hole!!! ....A lot of people here only see what they want to see.

Well I am out for lunch... I will read more later.

Best Regards Neil, Luis

 

[Neil Gubitz]

Ok.... you got me on that one.... and, yes, I DO apologize for THAT!!....

I STILL say you're a thief, though, and that Matt will NEVER see his Ball Pythons, ESPECIALLY if the necropsy comes back with just the HINT of "questionable" results, you will say anything you have to in order to keep those snakes....
You're pathetic, or Matt would have ALREADY had his pythons.... All your excuses can't resolve the fact that Matt should have had his snakes LONG BEFORE that Albino got ill (SIX WEEKS AFTER BEING IN *YOUR* CARE)....

Did anybody even think of the fact that the rats he fed the Albino weren't thawed out properly??.... If that snake ate a rat that was still frozen on the inside, it could have JUST those symptoms, and the intense cold would easily kill it in a day or so.... but that's just conjecture.... or is it??

Neil

 

[Laura Fopiano]

You're pathetic, or Matt would have ALREADY had his pythons.... All your excuses can't resolve the fact that Matt should have had his snakes LONG BEFORE that Albino got ill (SIX WEEKS AFTER BEING IN *YOUR* CARE)....

Did anybody even think of the fact that the rats he fed the Albino weren't thawed out properly??.... If that snake ate a rat that was still frozen on the inside, it could have JUST those symptoms, and the intense cold would easily kill it in a day or so.... but that's just conjecture.... or is it??

Neil

Ya think?? I've been speculating that the moment this thread started.......
Luis, I won't call you an out and out thief, however, your business practices and quarantine procedures could lead one to believe that this is not about the love of the animals, but, the possibility of the money said animals could bring.......what a shame that an animal had to die........

 

[Junkyard]

Dear Neal....
I knew an a-hole would come up ...so I save these pictures.

Because I just called you an A-Hole!!! ....A lot of people here only see what they want to see.

Well I am out for lunch... I will read more later.

Best Regards Neil, Luis

I am pretty sure name calling is not allowed, even under disguise, is it not?

 

[Chameleon Company]

Luis, I am not in the market to buy what you sell....

I have to say that I approve of your decision to finally participate in the thread, but my position is also that I see the necropsy issue and results as a red-herring here. As Dennis and many others have pointed out, the overwhelming opinion is that you did not fulfill your terms of the deal, and that Matt did. I am not sure if you will ever resolve this satisfactorily, and by that I mean within the consensus that exists in this thread. If you choose not to oblige Matt, this thread, and the opinions it has now fostered about you should it go unrepaired, will haunt your reputation. I am of the group that does not quibble much about how someone takes care of their own animals, so long as they confine the poor husbandry to their own animals. Not here to call you names, and don't have questions that need answering. I can accept that you were in a pinch, but see it as immaterial to your obligation to Matt. Judging solely on that obligation, which is still the issue, you have made some poor choices to this point, and would hope that you would see the benefit of fixing things with Matt, and then just moving forward the wiser, and less disliked at that point as well.

 

[HerpHobbiest]

Since the Snake die... I remended a Necropsy. Matt and I agree to that.

Matt recommended to hold off to the Ball Pythons until the Necropsy results come. Again Matt and I agree to that.

The is Snake is with a Professional who will offer his expertise in getting the answers Matt and I are seeking.

What I do not understand is why people are guessing what happen to the snake? A frozen Rat, or a failing Thermostat. Maybe it got struck by a meteorite too?

And how is it that the Necropsy results are irrelevant. They are very relevant. Is not like I gave the snake to a highschool teacher to have his students figure it out.

I have confidence that the Arizona Veterinary Diagnostic Laboratory of the University of Arizona. has the knowledge and the equipment needed to do their job.

And if you must reply please know what you are talking about. Read the post throughly.

When the results are in Matt and I will talk. And I will do the right and fair thing.

How am I a thief when the results of the Necropsy are not even done?

How many of you have already made up your minds with out the Necropsy Results??? I know there is a few. But I will not call their names. They are making idiots out of themselves.

I think there is not much more to say until results are in.

You all have a nice day, Luis

 

[Junkyard]

Luis, I do not think anyone thinks the necropsy results are irrelevant. Though many have questioned you as to why you did not take care of things quicker or why this situation had to come out in the open before you took action.