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Mites and filth are free with Ray Goushaw Herpetological Breeding Research

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You know, I'm not going to bother reading this entire thread.

I know a little bit about some people and although I have never done business with Ray I do know that he is the type of person that takes responsibility for actions relating to him or his business.

What he will or will not do I have no clue BUT until he has a chance to do or to not do something, it's all just speculation. You know what specualtion is worth? Go spit in a cup until it's full. You now have a cup of spit worth exactly as much as all this speculation is.

Cool out and be patient. He's got a great rep, give him a chance to get home.
 
Are Wes and Dan both robots created by the same evil genius? Speculation, speculation Will Robinson, Speculation. It is not speculation for Tim to come here and post the facts as he sees them of a transaction he is unhappy with for obvious reasons. I aggree with the "Ray needs to ad to the thread" "Ray will post his side" as I have been saying that all along, but I am getting tired of the word speculation when facts have been posted. And Dan, I was joking, you have no sense of humor.
 
Evan,

I do not think Wes was referring to Tim. I think it was the Peanut Gallery that his post was intended.

Sincerely,

Planters
 
John: I only worship one person - God. And I never did business with that other person, but had a different understanding of his loosing his temper on the eve of his incarceration. I did not say what he said was right or wrong, as it's more than obvious that it was wrong. However I just understood how he could be easily provoked to say such things as his mind was not straight that particular evening and under the circumstances that he was being publically exposed after reaching out to help a friend. Now all because I said I can understand it, I had a bunch of readers telling me I said he was right. I never said that he was right, I said I understood how he could be provoked. And I can forgive him for it. Obviously some people cannot and will not. God will at least, and thats what counts right?

Evan: Perhaps I did not read your post in detail and did not see the joke? Communication via posting emails is very difficult. Perhaps I did not clarify enough for you. I did not mean that Tim was speculating, never said he was speculating, or made any reference that could be misinterpreted that he was speculating. If I did, it was unintentional.
 
wilomn said:
You know, I'm not going to bother reading this entire thread.

I know a little bit about some people and although I have never done business with Ray I do know that he is the type of person that takes responsibility for actions relating to him or his business.

What he will or will not do I have no clue BUT until he has a chance to do or to not do something, it's all just speculation. You know what specualtion is worth? Go spit in a cup until it's full. You now have a cup of spit worth exactly as much as all this speculation is.

Cool out and be patient. He's got a great rep, give him a chance to get home.

I already said all that in an earlier post but *I* did not have to mention SPIT. EEEEWW....... :rofl:
 
Seems to me that the packing sucked, and the animal had mites (who was it that wrote: "they are no big deal" ???? WTF????)...he can be the nicest guy on the planet...but the shipment sucked b*lls.

fact.

greg
 
Red points or not, anyone who thinks that mites are no big deal is an idiot. Period. Parasites are NEVER the sign of a good keeper...I can't imagine the moron who sends out a ridden animal !!!!!
And yes, I am 41 and I do swear...get over it.

:) greg
 
It looks as if...

...Ray got back from vacation.

http://thereptileroom.org/forum/index.php?act=ST&f=2&t=2430&st=60#entry23401

I guess we will have to wait for a reply to this thread while he tries to rescue some reptiles. Almost makes me wonder hearing that word "rescue" :rolleyes: ......in on rescue today..out for sale tomorrow. Very easy to miss things such as mites that way.

I add it up and it I dont like it. Knowing he is a rescue shelter for reptiles + crappy packing + mites + filthy snake bag + poor communication = ????

Dan, seeing as though youre his biggest fan can you ask him to post a resolution to this?
 
Response...

First off let me explain the situation... I have spent several years without a vacation. Having over 400 animals(permanent collection) limits the time you have to do anything! Several months ago I made the time to book a few days off to go to the Caribbean(Ssp?) Photo some herps etc. When the order was made it was a day or two before I left. I normally ship UPS unless it's venomous. I had no problem with shipping Delta since this was what the customer requested. I had an employee going down to the airport that afternoon anyway. I spoke with Tim and gave him the airbill number. I told him to call Delta late that afternoon or evening to find out when it would arrive. The shipment was booked and everything seemed fine. When my employee arrived the personel at Delta said they didn't have a booking showing. After arguing with them for some time they agreed that it would go out on the next flight to Atlanta then to it's destination.(Dash) (Keep in mind that Delta doesn't always follow flight schedules and they can change. It's impossible for me to spend the time to track the shipment hourly. When I get shipments from Delta the shipper simply gives me an airbill. I contact Delta and get an approximate time for arrival. About two hours before the prescibed arrival I contact them again to confirm it will arrive on time. Then I make arrangements for pickup.) At this point I didn't hear anything from Tim until two days later in regards to the fact that he had found a few mites on the snake. I was distraught that a C.B. snake would have mites in my collection. Not impossible but, very unlikely since every single animal is checked daily. I asked him if the snake was placed in a CLEAN WHITE BAG and how it was packed. At this time no mention was made of any packing problems. He responded that no it was in an older pillowcase. When I thought about it I responded that that may be where any mites may have come from...Possibly one of my employee's packed the snake in an old pillow case that may have had imports previously placed in it. (We usually keep these separate or are thrown out.) At this time I apologized and told Tim that for any reason he was unhappy with the snake he could return the specimen for a refund. However, I would be out of the COUNTRY(not simply out of town) until this Monday. When my employee packed the shipment I had no reason to doubt his abilities. He has worked for me on and off for over 20 years. He's a very accomplished herper and usually is very studious in packing. He's packed thousands of shipments with no problems. He know he made a mistake and it will NOT happen again. However, the ultimate responsibility lies with me. Right now is the tail end of breeding season for many boids and pythons.(Many in our collection are gravid, have laid or had babies. Also, as many know it's right in the middle of breeding season for colubrids and many of the lizard and turtle species we work with. Throw in a number of lectures, field research projects, exhibits then try to get ready to leave out of the country at the same time!! I don't know why my employee used a old box? However, he did make an effort to pack it properly.(1/2" styro on 6 sides, heat pack, newspaper to cushion the specimen etc.) Marked and packed as per IATA regulations. Could the box and packing have been cleaner and neater? Yes... Was it packed safely? Yes... Was a mistake made and a captive specimen placed in an import bag? Possibly. Was this my fault? Ultimately yes... At no time did I question Tim's integrity or word. I simply asked him to wait until I returned to ship the specimen back. I wanted to see the mistake for myself. If my employee made the mistake in the first place why would I want it returned when only my employee could verify a problem? Did I argue about the return? Not at all! I do not take the mite problem lightly. I would not want them near any of my C.B. animals myself! They may be rather easy to get rid of but, they can be vectors for disease. I wouldn't panic about it since I know what to do but, I wouldn't be happy either!! Now to end this whole arguement....Was a mistake made...Yes. Did I owe up to it even though it was not directly my fault? Yes. Did I offer a refund? Yes. Did I communicate when I would be able to accept the return and refund? Yes... Tim I understand your disappointment however, I think you are a little rash in posting here when I HAVE been communicating with you. It's a little hard to get calls or receive calls 200 miles offshore in the ocean!!! Which by the way , I figured you would understand? Please simply return the specimen. I will place her in quarantine and send a full refund. By the way...read PAYPAL's policy. I did not blow you off for 7 days so that you could not file a claim. You can file a claim with paypal for up to 30 days after the purchase. However, they will not refund if you have received the shipment.(They do not guarantee quality etc. You can only get a refund if you do not receive a shipment) So I guess your wrong there. Also, in regards to smelling a stench 10 feet away...Delta would have pulled the shipment. Now lets look at your pictures... The box was inside out which makes that side generally clean. Also, the outside of the box appears to be quite uniformly clean other than bent screen on the side. The bag....appears to have one uric acid stain. The styro may not fit EXACTLY 100% to the box but it's close and it's brand new and clean!!. Where's the newspaper from the bag and the box? I understand that you are trying to make this look much worse than it is by exaggerating these facts....I understand that you may have wanted immediate satisfaction. I make every effort to satisfy my customers. I don't know you or have a reason to trust you, I don't know that the snake did have mites, I don't know that it wasn't buyer's remorse, I don't know how you take care of your collection however, all I need to know is that you were unhappy and wish to return the specimen. That is my guarantee... I don't need to know these things, only that you were unhappy. I could argue the point that I DO NOT see anymites on the bag but, we'll leave it at that. I'll be happy to refund the specimen. A little patience goes a long way. I'm sure that you will understand when your collection is large enough that getting away for a few days every year or two is important to both you and your hopefully very patient fiancee'. *P.S. you will find a e-mail that was sent to you about two hours before this that said I'm back you can ship the snake Monday. Again IF the specimen came in with mites I do apologize. We treat ALL specimens externally and internally for parasites wether imports OR exports. Mistakes can happen...P.S.S. You insinuated that I had time to post or delete adds on KS??? They will automatically come down if not renewed!!! Thanks, and everyone have a good weekend!
 
"Was this my fault? Ultimately yes... At no time did I question Tim's integrity or word. I simply asked him to wait until I returned to ship the specimen back."

Ray: You stood up, took responsibility, offered a refund; I think you did all you could do here. You covered all points well in your post, too.
 
herpetological said:
I didn't hear anything from Tim until two days later in regards to the fact that he had found a few mites on the snake.

Can you post that email correspondance because Tim is stating the snake was infested, not just a "few" mites.

herpetological said:
I was distraught that a C.B. snake would have mites in my collection. Not impossible but, very unlikely since every single animal is checked daily.

Are you saying that had it been a wild caught animal in your collection its acceptable? I have both in my collection and no mites.

herpetological said:
I asked him if the snake was placed in a CLEAN WHITE BAG and how it was packed. At this time no mention was made of any packing problems. He responded that no it was in an older pillowcase. When I thought about it I responded that that may be where any mites may have come from...Possibly one of my employee's packed the snake in an old pillow case that may have had imports previously placed in it.

Have you seen the box Ray? One of your employees is either a major crackhead or someone doesnt give a poop how packages go out.

herpetological said:
(We usually keep these separate or are thrown out.) At this time I apologized and told Tim that for any reason he was unhappy with the snake he could return the specimen for a refund.

On your bill? You'll pay the shipping charge back to you? That would be a nice thing.

herpetological said:
When my employee packed the shipment I had no reason to doubt his abilities. He has worked for me on and off for over 20 years. He's a very accomplished herper and usually is very studious in packing. He's packed thousands of shipments with no problems. He know he made a mistake and it will NOT happen again.

This doesnt explain the packing job for a person who packed thousands of orders.

herpetological said:
However, the ultimate responsibility lies with me.

herpetological said:
Right now is the tail end of breeding season for many boids and pythons.(Many in our collection are gravid, have laid or had babies. Also, as many know it's right in the middle of breeding season for colubrids and many of the lizard and turtle species we work with. Throw in a number of lectures, field research projects, exhibits then try to get ready to leave out of the country at the same time!!

Why not just stop accepting orders if your too busy to provide the level of service that is industry standard and expected? I really think this is a lame explination from you. You had the time to negotiate a deal and accept payment did you not?

herpetological said:
I don't know why my employee used a old box? However, he did make an effort to pack it properly.(1/2" styro on 6 sides, heat pack, newspaper to cushion the specimen etc.)

LOL. Ray stop please. You had no new boxes or styrofoam that fit the box. End of story.

herpetological said:
Was it packed safely? Yes

No it wasnt. Anyone can clearly see that from the photos.

herpetological said:
... Was a mistake made and a captive specimen placed in an import bag? Possibly.

Its your shop Ray. Dont you have a definitive answer?

herpetological said:
Was this my fault? Ultimately yes

And do you know what? I've enough of reading this crap so I've snipped the rest of the post and decided to accept the fact you could have blown yourself into the Carribean with all that hot air you have.

Whats your excuse for not communicating or paying the Fedex shipping charge to Chris Johnson of Top Shelf Exotics?

Would you like a side order of scrambled eggs with your waffles?
 
Come on bill

Come on man. Guess thats why you have the nick "critical Bill." You have to admit, mistakes do happen.
And whether it was a shortcoming directly on Ray's part or indirectly via one of his employees, he has owned up to it and offered a resolution.

While it shouldn't have happened, it did, and no one can change that fact.
What will make the customer happy, or at least salvage the deal??? taking the animal back and issuing a refund.

I know I have made misstakes, and I am reasonably sure that you have as well.


TOM
 
Ray did exactly what we had hoped he would do in early posts that most of us made. He came here when he got home, apologized, offered a refund and took the hit for his employee. That is good stuff. I know it is hard not to get upset with people jumping on you on here (as I have demonstrated by evicerating people in the past on the BOI) but cooler heads sure do make things more pleasant. Ray, you did head down that road a bit towards the end of your post with a few mild jabs, but credit to you for being mellow about this thread and handling it the way you did.
 
Come on?

Where are we going? Scuba Diving in the Carribean? Sorry, Ive got orders to fill and get out.

Its just the way I see it. And yes, Ive made mistakes, but never once when it came to safely packing and shipping a live animal. There is little room for any margin of error when shipping live animals.

That Ray can defend the package by saying it was safely packed for transit is all the reason I needed to cut through the crap.


Zoo Supply said:
Come on man. Guess thats why you have the nick "critical Bill." You have to admit, mistakes do happen.
And whether it was a shortcoming directly on Ray's part or indirectly via one of his employees, he has owned up to it and offered a resolution.

While it shouldn't have happened, it did, and no one can change that fact.
What will make the customer happy, or at least salvage the deal??? taking the animal back and issuing a refund.

I know I have made misstakes, and I am reasonably sure that you have as well.


TOM
 
I’ll have to agree with Lucille and Evan. Ray came back and took care of the problem right away, this was what we wanted to see and this is what happened right away. No ifs or buts. If anyone feels the need to “draw blood” please go back and look at the track record of the individual, what he is currently doing, and what he has done for this hobby/business. Those that have been around here for a while knew exactly what to expect from Ray, and he didn’t disappoint us. In my opinion this was not even a mistake, it was just an accident. Those odd occurrences that happen when are least expected.
Was a mistake made and a captive specimen placed in an import bag? Possibly.
Ray,
One thing with the bag though. The picture shows it is labeled “bearded” that may help you track down the origin of those mites.
Kindly,
 
Ray emailed me saying he would take back the animal and refund my money and yes this is what I want to do so I am trying to set up shipping for this monday. I would rather get my money back before shipping back to him but if he won't I understand. I did tell him to read that email he sent to me about him going out of town since I never saw it. As far as buyers remorse I bought her to breed my High End Albino male too and there is no way I would do that now.

Tim
 
Sop

Tim,

In nearly every transaction it’s customary to return the merchandise before you are issued a full refund. I’m glad everything was resolved to your satisfaction.

Regards.
 
herpetological said:
Having over 400 animals(permanent collection) limits the time you have to do anything! I was distraught that a C.B. snake would have mites in my collection. Not impossible but, very unlikely since every single animal is checked daily.

No joke eh? Checking 400 animals daily (each day) must be quite a task. Exactly how many employees are we talking here?
 
I am kind of curious as to how many naked pictures of you all Ray seems to have...anyone else pulls this kind of stunt and you jump all over the dealer...but not in THIS case...why?
Being a firm believer in impartial justice...Ray seems to be kind of a flake...even though he admits it is his "fault in the end", he still blames employees and the need for a vacation as the problem here...
Sorry, I don't buy it.

I am puzzled why some of you feel the need to defend the actions of his company...clearly not good. ???

greg
 
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