TW International Wyatt in Texas

[snake5007]

I always knew that Wyatt was a Wyatt with the Y removed and a T at front. I wish you luck in serving that scumbag what he deserves.

 

[Cat_72]

*listens to the nails being pounded into Wyatt's coffin*

THUD.
THUD.
THUD.

 

[ravensgait]

Well it looks like I owe you an apology Jen, though I still think you jumped the gun you have been vindicated, though small comfort that is for you now. Hope all your animals recover and you get some nice babies from those two girls..

Cat those look like 3 of the last 6 nails left to seal that puppy up. Seems we have a typhoid Wyatt on our hands, wonder if the state Ag. department can do anything about it, yeah I doubt it too but ya never know.
Randy

 

[jscrick]

I seriously doubt any of this really matters to the Damian Wyatt I know. Sounds like he's moved on. Doubt he'll even look back.
It's a shame he's in health care. The used car market's loss.
jsc

 

[JoeEllisReptiles]

wyatt

His wife or girlfriend told me he is in iraq for a year. Wyatt sucks

 

[Lynn]

His wife or girlfriend told me he is in iraq for a year. Wyatt sucks

What...............Why? I know he had rats delivered to his house the other day...

 

[JoeEllisReptiles]

It was more than likely a lie. I just wish I got my fire female back from him.

 

[Lynn]

It was more than likely a lie. I just wish I got my fire female back from him.

I do too..He is so wrong..i truely beleive in karma..

 

[Pink Lady Exotics]

His wife or girlfriend told me he is in iraq for a year. Wyatt sucks

That disgusts me -- that they would use that kind of EXCUSE to get out of giving people back their animals. Tell them to come talk to someone whose husband WAS IN IRAQ FOR THE LAST 15 MONTHS and now has to deal with the aftermath, I'll shut them up very quickly.

 

[Cat_72]

That disgusts me -- that they would use that kind of EXCUSE to get out of giving people back their animals. Tell them to come talk to someone whose husband WAS IN IRAQ FOR THE LAST 15 MONTHS and now has to deal with the aftermath, I'll shut them up very quickly.

That is even lower than I thought Wyatt would sink......what a piece of .

Karma can't come round quick or hard enough for him, IMO.

 

[critical bill]

That disgusts me -- that they would use that kind of EXCUSE to get out of giving people back their animals. Tell them to come talk to someone whose husband WAS IN IRAQ FOR THE LAST 15 MONTHS and now has to deal with the aftermath, I'll shut them up very quickly.

I imagine the transition has been quite difficult for him and you. Please tell your husband that I said Thank You.

 

[Pink Lady Exotics]

I will Chuck, thank you. He's not handling the re-integration very well...a lot of nightmares and depression. Plus we've been apart so long and so much has changed since he left (with our daughter, our animals, me, everything), that he's having a tough time fitting back in and catching up. It doesn't help that we're still apart -- that he's in Texas and I'm up here. Nor that we lost so many snakes and money along with those snakes that was earned by his deployment. I'm sure if I mentioned to him that Wyatt is acting like going to Iraq is some joke, he'd love to take a drive 2 hours north...

Randy, no apology necessary -- you were just stating your opinion based on what info we had back then. I did jump the gun, but at the same time I just knew there was no way it could have come from any other source because my animals have always been just fine, as had animals I'd just recently sold to people when this all first happened (and they still are fine, I checked in with each and every person to make sure). When Mike came forward with his sick animals, that was what told me I was right. And now Jason -- especially with the exact same symptoms, cultures, medication resistances -- it just makes too much sense. I'm just glad to have the 2 mothers -- even if they hadn't laid eggs, I would still be thrilled that they made it through. They were both rescues from 2 years ago that I saved from near death. They're very special to me.

 

[Pink Lady Exotics]

New info...

RE: P.S.‏
From: Dr. Jason Brodnik ([email protected])
Sent: Fri 4/11/08 12:56 PM
To: Jennifer Harrison ([email protected])

Jennifer,
The titer came back 1:8 for paramyxovirus titer exposure.



Dr. Jason Brodnik
Certified Level One Veterinary Laser Surgeon
International Veterinary Academy of Pain Management

P.O. Box 33293
Northglenn, CO 80233

303-903-6603

New info...‏
From: Jennifer Harrison ([email protected])
Sent: Sat 4/12/08 9:23 AM
To: [email protected]

Hi Jason -- I called Dr. Gordon this morning regarding your titre results, and he said he had just spoken to you last night about it, which was great to hear. I asked him if you did the same test Dr. Jacobsen did and he said similar, but that the difference was the titre only checks for antibody response, indicating exposure to the virus, whereas Elliot's test checks for actual virus presence. He said that while our test didn't get a paramyxo reaction, the big possibility that they're looking at right now is that it could be a hybrid virus -- considering the conditions Wyatt may be keeping his snakes in to harbor things like OPMV, it is very likely there are other viruses present in his animals and the potential for dual-infection and evolving into combined viruses is pretty high. Dr. Gordon thinks that because the virus die-off and subsequent healing in my collection coincided with my use of the Colombovac vaccine (proven to stop OMPV in multiple cases in Europe), that there is proof of the presence of paramyxo within the viral DNA structure, but not fully enough to cause a reaction to Elliot's test. The remaining majority of the DNA is a type of reovirus, indicated by the strong reaction to the reovirus test -- and Elliot e-mailed him mentioning a myovirus? That is something new that Dr. Gordon hasn't heard of yet, so he needs to research it, but as of right now he feels that Elliot is withholding info until he finds out more, because as a researcher he wants to be the one to stake the claim on the discovery. Dr. Gordon expects my new bottle of Colombovac to be here next week or so, and he mentioned that you should be able to submit your own permit to the FDA, but it will take weeks to get approved and then more weeks to get the bottle shipped from overseas, so if you would like to get your other snakes vaccinated ASAP, you can contact him and get another bottle through him. Or I will have him give you mine and I will wait for the next one. I don't want to see you lose your snakes like I lost almost all of mine.


~* Jen *~

 

[Pink Lady Exotics]

Jason sent me this link regarding OPMV and reoviruses, and I found it very applicable to what Dr. Gordon and Dr. Jacobsen have been trying to figure out.

http://www.smuggled.com/OPMV17.htm

The part that caught me:

“A hemagglutination-inhibition (HI) assay has been developed to measure antibody produced against OPMV (Jacobson et al., 1981), however in experiments, some snakes produced no antibodies some weeks after infection and others actually died before any antibodies appeared. Hence a negative HI assay cannot be taken to exclude the possibility an OPMV infection. It appears that in some snakes OPMV antibodies form about 8 weeks after infection.”

So the negative reaction to Elliot’s test that the above states he himself developed really doesn’t mean anything — those 2 females had only been sick for about 3-4 weeks before I brought them in for euthanasia/dissection for sampling, and they very well could have not developed antibodies yet according to the above. Hence the negative result, but the continued feeling by all vets involved of OPMV making sense based on everything that has happened, the symptoms, the infection, the secondary pneumonia, and the vaccine coinciding with a random die-off of the virus. I think I am going to see if we can draw a titre on one or both of my two surviving recovered females to check again for OPMV antibodies. They were sick long enough that it should be present.

Dr. Brodnik also gave me some good news last night – I’m able to continue working with my breeding projects and can keep going with my hobby:

RE: P.S.‏
From: Dr. Jason Brodnik ([email protected])
Sent: Sun 4/13/08 1:09 AM
To: Jennifer Harrison ([email protected])

Jennifer,
From what I understand, they will be susceptible to shipping [exposure to cold], and may have scar tissue, but any eggs would not be affected if removed and incubated. So they could remain in the breeding pool [my 2 recovered females]. The disease is spread through fluids and mucous secretions, so the eggs would not be affected. If an antigen test were performed, it would show whether any virus was present. An antibody test would only show exposure. If you did an antigen test [Dr. Jacobsen did], and it was negative [it was], after 60 days they would not be considered infective.

I think to recoup anything via Paypal, I needed to submit a claim by March 22nd, which was 30 days from my last payment, so I probably don't have a claim through it. Damian has yet to respond to my request from yesterday, he'll probably blow it off. I am not sure what my recourse will be. I will call Dr. Gordan on Monday, thank you. Have you told him already? How much is it?



Dr. Jason Brodnik
Certified Level One Veterinary Laser Surgeon
International Veterinary Academy of Pain Management

P.O. Box 33293
Northglenn, CO 80233

303-903-6603

The bits in [ ] are snipits I added in to better explain what he was referring to. The above info coincides with Dr. Jacobsen’s information on OPMV — the infection can be considered dead after it has been 60-90 days since the last death/active symptom. So based on the above, the few remaining animals I have left are OK and the 2 recovered females do not have to be euthanized. Regardless of the negative antigen test and their lack of exposure/infectiousness, I still would rather err on the side of caution and not ever sell/trade any of the animals that were here during this period to anyone else. After what they went through, they deserve to stay with me forever. As far as new additions coming into my collection, they were not present during the exposure so will be deemed safe, and can be resold/traded if ever necessary as long as there wasn't another flare up or symptomatic infectious snake. The eggs and babies I produce will be just fine. I feel like a huge weight has been lifted from my shoulders.

 

[Pink Lady Exotics]

I'm sure everyone's probably annoyed with me dragging this thread up, but it needs to be kept up to date as things happen.

RE: P.S.‏
From: Dr. Jason Brodnik ([email protected])
Sent: Sun 4/13/08 6:45 PM
To: Jennifer Harrison ([email protected])

Jennifer,
The snake I got from Damian died this morning. She was $1,000. The male that contracted it is still alive. Damian hasn't responded, and has now changed is email address, the emails I send come back undelivered now. I will call him when I get back home and find his number. He'll blow me off I am sure, if he answers at all.



Dr. Jason Brodnik
Certified Level One Veterinary Laser Surgeon
International Veterinary Academy of Pain Management

P.O. Box 33293
Northglenn, CO 80233

303-903-6603

 

[jscrick]

Don't mind a bit. I say keep posting, Jen. It's all good information. Does anyone know if Boa constrictor ssp. are effected by these viruses? That is why I originally contacted you regarding this.
Of course, keeping this thread active and giving Damian the exposure he deserves doesn't hurt.
jsc

 

[Pink Lady Exotics]

As of right now, we don't know yet. My rainbow boas and corns were entirely unaffected -- they've all been doing just great throughout the ordeal. As with all viruses, the potential is there for it to evolve and affect new species. Dr. Jacobsen has to do a lot more research into it, and Dr. Gordon is doing his own as well.

 

[Pink Lady Exotics]

Another loss.

FW: Search Results from USSearch.com‏
From: Dr. Jason Brodnik ([email protected])
Sent: Wed 4/16/08 10:50 AM
To: [email protected]


The male het pied died today. Here is some background info that will make service for court easier. I did searches on both of them, and will try to make them uncomfortable with knowing as much about them as I gleened. [he attached the information as a document]



Dr. Jason Brodnik
Certified Level One Veterinary Laser Surgeon
International Veterinary Academy of Pain Management

P.O. Box 33293
Northglenn, CO 80233

303-903-6603

Wyatt, do you plan on making any of this right or reimbursing us for our losses? I know you are reading this, as Jason mentioned in your last communication to him (before you conveniently closed your e-mail address account and changed your phone number) that you were angry about things being posted on here and that you were still denying any and all responsibility.

 

[Pink Lady Exotics]

Wyatt actually decided to contact me, first time in many months.

Faunaclassifieds‏
From: TW Inter ([email protected])
Sent: Wed 4/16/08 12:24 PM
To: [email protected]

Jennifer,
I know that you are going to post it anyways but when I get I get back I will be more than happy to visit with your husband about what I am doing over here. As you well know I am only able to get to a computer when I get to HQ. As far as what your question goes, what would you like for me to do. I had to file for Ch 12 bankruptcy and go from my reserve status to active duty. Let me inform you that I am totally oblivious to any knowledge that I sent out any viruses or infections from my collection. When I left I still had 30-40 balls that were healthy and that were produced from my own stock that is still thriving. After receiving the email from Jason, when I return I will be performing saliva test on all of my remaining stock. Like I said, you can post this all you want. I will never respond to the BOI and other than what you are accusing, I still have over 300 specimens from my own collection that I have sold that are in other collections and alive and doing great!! I have already been in contact with my past customers about this and if you decide that you want to pursue this in a court of law, over 100 of my past customers have already admitted to wanting to give there testimony to the success of the snakes they received from me. In fact there are several well known breeders that advertise on kingsnake right now that sell ball morphs that were started from my morphs several years ago. Let me know what you think I should do in this case.

RE: Faunaclassifieds‏
From: Jennifer Harrison ([email protected])
Sent: Wed 4/16/08 1:36 PM
To: TW Inter ([email protected])

Wyatt, I really don't know at this point. I would sincerely much prefer to have this issue settled between the parties involved on a private basis, not through a court case that is only going to cause more stress, more animosity, and cost more money. I'm so emotional and financially exhausted -- the entire mess has played and extremely large part in the divorce my husband and I are now heading toward. It was the final straw with his already present dislike of my snakes, and the fact that he lost thousands of dollars that he gave me to jumpstart my collection and had earned by putting his life on the line every day over in Iraq. If you filed for bankruptcy as you say, then do you really have any kinds of funds to reimburse anyone for their losses? Mike lost 2 snakes, I lost 12, Jason has now lost 2 (and we don't know if that will be all as his is just beginning). My few remaining snakes are still breedable, but they themselves are not worth any monetary value anymore as I could never sell them, for risk of infecting someone else if they do indeed carry it and flare up while in that person's collection. I spent over $1200 in vet bills with the first 3 vets here in Wisconsin, and have a bill waiting for me at the University of Florida for $3000, most likely more as we have to conduct further tests, further analysis, further research. I do admit that it could be possible that you didn't know a virus was present in your collection when you sold to me (although with OPMV, it requires an active symptomatic infection for the virus to shed and spread to others) -- but what makes that possibility completely obsolete is that after first recieving an indication that the het clown I recieved fell ill and was causing other snakes to fall ill, you continued to sell snakes to other people, right down to the sister to the het clown. That is what blew my mind. Had it been someone responsible, they would have immediately closed their collection and shut down all breeding, buying, and selling (as I did) until they could establish proof on both their end and the affected buyer's end that it was not from their animal. I would not have wanted to risk infecting someone else, especially as at that point we had no idea what it was, how it was spread, or how deadly it was.

I lost over $5800 in animals (not counting the normal breeder females and dinking project animals that were lost nor the values of my remaining animals that are unsellable), and have $4200 in vet bills. That's over $10K in losses, and doesn't even touch the emotional pain I've gone through helplessly watching my animals and pets suffer and die slow, excrutiatingly painful deaths. I lost pets that I will never be able to get back.

~* Jen *~

 

[Gecko_Den]

I had to file for Ch 12 bankruptcy

So Wyatt was a "farmer" or a "fisherman"?

http://www.uscourts.gov/bankruptcycourts/bankruptcybasics/chapter12.html