Skinthedirt (Emily Paine).
You have not displayed any knowledge of Australian law or venomoid surgery. You are effectively unknown in herpetology.
Operations performed by myself were done legally. You may not agree with the law, but so be it. To argue with you would be like dealing with a Christian Fundamentalist!
Description of our venomoid operations as subpar is not supported by the evidence, which is a perfect record of results and happy healthy snakes.
Mark O’Shea has no credibility whatsoever, especially noting his own appalling snakebite and mishandling history so to claim anything written by him is of value does not merit a response. His claim venomoids regenerate venom is patently false. He has no expertise on the subject at all.
Finally, can you please advise me as to what expertise you have in performing venomoid surgery including how many operations you have conducted and the results of all.
To Imajacobian, you wrote:
“Why avoid the questions. Simply post some pics of the operation showing it is simple and answer a few questions.”
My response is I published a big paper in 2004 and have a devenomized venomoid snake FAQ site as well. Both images are shown and all sensible questions are answered as well. As it appears you have not seen these the link is provided here:
http://www.smuggled.com/VenFAQ1.htm
Now to Snakehandler.
A few facts you have omitted or lied about!
1 – We have statements including from a former employee of yours that you have sought to send people to our educational shows for the purposes of stealing and committing other crimes. That is not ethical business practice on your part. You have also confirmed the same on several occasions by your own statements.
2 – We have statements including from a former employee of yours that you are corruptly protected from prosecution for criminal offences by your friend Glenn Sharp of the DSE, corroborated by statements from another DSE employee.
3 - We have statements including from a former employee of yours that Mr Watharow of Snakehandler, had several vials of Tiger Snake anti-venom from a bite sustained when in charge of the business Snakehandler. You have reported the same yourself on other chat forums, so to try to deny this fact now is scandalous.
4 - We have statements including from a former employee of yours that you had a large dangerous Mulga Snake escape from your facility in a suburban area that was not recaptured and remains at large. That constitutes a serious criminal offence.
5 - We have statements including from a former employee of yours that you have actively stalked and committed criminal offences against our company.
6 - We have statements including from a former employee of yours that your snakes have repeatedly bitten members of the public at displays, which contradicts your claims above.
7 – You have no legal protocol to deal with the event of a venomous snake bite in one of your displays. Your risk management protocol only involves administering first aid and hospitalization but not removal of the venomous bite risk (either the snakes themselves or the venom glands), the latter being our proven effective means of dealing with the problem of venomous snake displays in public and the previously inherent (and now illegal) risks, noting that unlike your relatively new company, our established business has never had owner or staff taken to hospital for snakebites in any circumstances, even though our expertise and handling is of far greater extent.
8 – You have created and/or posted on hate facebook pages and admitted in court recently that you had lied about myself to a global public audience for the purposes of attacking our established education business.
9 – We do not tape up mouths of non-venomous reptiles, be they crocodiles or snakes, when it is not required and there is no credible safety risk (even in event of bite), beyond what would be described as superficial wounds and as covered by the terms of our business and bookings. There is no breach of any law in not doing so. You are lying to claim otherwise! Other demonstrators display same or similar reptiles in similar ways. You are free to market your business as not allowing the public to hold reptiles, as in hands-off displays, as you have done recently on other forums, but we shall continue to do hands-on reptile shows that let people handle the animals for as long as it remains legal.
10 – Your claim your staff are trained and experienced is a lie. You yourself have been licenced to handle snakes in any form less than ten years and so lack experience in the relevant field!
11 – You telephoned me seeking venomoid snakes in 2005. I declined your request. You decided to wage war against us from then on. We would rather you go back to where you came from!
12 – I do not attack your business in any way.
We do rebut false claims you repeatedly make against us and when appropriate point out the safety issues relating to yours and other displays.
If and when people seek to compare businesses, be it yours or any others, I quite properly point out that our business that has run longer than yours and all others in our market and we have a perfect safety record and your business and many others do not, noting I have been in the reptile education business longer than all other mobile displayers trading in our market. Many of our clients are concerned about the safety of their children and others and we make sure they are aware of where risks lie and how we have taken the issue seriously by devenomizing our snakes to both remove risk of serious venomous bite and to comply with the 2004 O H and S Act.
13 - You have been the source of many false claims against us, including on your various “Hate sites” and we have had some deleted as a result. We have not engaged in tit-for-tat false claims against your enterprise, even though the urge to rebut your incessant false claims remains.
14 – In terms of venomous snake displays in Victoria, Phil Fisher of Worksafe issued a ruling in 2006 that it is illegal to display venomous snakes not made venomoid. It is a sensible ruling and one I agree with. That you have not been prosecuted for breaching the Worksafe and other acts, including the Wildlife act, is scandalous and a matter of deep concern among a large number of people within the reptile fraternity, including among your ex-employees. As one concerned about animal welfare I am not happy that you continue to engage in extreme acts of animal cruelty without risk of prosecution, including the use and advocacy of brutal metal tongs to handle venomous snake species. My public opposition to metal tongs to attack snakes pre-dates your lurching into the reptile business by two years and is common among experienced snake handlers. In your case the opposition is more vehement in that you also advocate the use of tongs in public forums and go further and engage in snake handler courses where you teach novices to use these barbaric devices, the result being a greater frequency of fatal and near fatal snake bites and snakes injured at time of capture.
15 – You state your employee Paul Fisher was not envenomated by a dangerous Brown Snake when bitten. You have not stated the obvious which is you could only ascertain this by having the man hospitalized and tested using equipment you did not possess, and that it is standard for anyone to be rushed to hospital in the event of a bite from this highly venomous species. To do otherwise would be reckless in the extreme. Fact is Fisher’s handling was at fault and as employer you are at fault for not ensuring your handlers can competently handle the said snakes. To allege the snakes were unduly stressed at the time as a reason for the bite is patently ridiculous.
16 – You wrote: “what happened prior to me purchasing the business is totally out of my control, unknown to me and of no consequence to my operations.” Which contradicts your detailed knowledge of these events posted by yourself on other forums.
17 (a) – We have statements including from a former employee of yours that you unlawfully collected fauna in Queensland and illegally imported it to Victoria and have not been prosecuted for this offence and others.
17 (b) – I have never lied about yourself in any way. Not only have you lied about myself and my business many times, but you have also admitted to doing so in court on two separate occasions!
18 – Now I suggest you and your lackeys stop stalking, harassing and posting false and defamatory statements against myself and allow us to deal with our core business of wildlife research, education and conservation including through the only guaranteed safe venomous snake shows in Australia.
19 – Finally, and not for the first time, you are again requested to cease and desist from illegally using our registered trademarks in any way to bootleg our business and clients or engage in any other forms of misleading and deceptive conduct, including by getting others to do this for you or as a means to attack or undermine our lawful education business. This includes your reliance on other trademark bootleggers to divert our clients to your enterprise via unlawful misleading and deceptive conduct.
Thank You!
Snakeman
defense". Spew a long enough filibuster, and maybe we'll lose interest in contesting that which doesn't successfully get buried in his rantings. I wouldn't say it's new, but it seems to be making a bit of a comeback. 