• Responding to email notices you receive.
    **************************************************
    In short, DON'T! Email notices are to ONLY alert you of a reply to your private message or your ad on this site. Replying to the email just wastes your time as it goes NOWHERE, and probably pisses off the person you thought you replied to when they think you just ignored them. So instead of complaining to me about your messages not being replied to from this site via email, please READ that email notice that plainly states what you need to do in order to reply to who you are trying to converse with.

  • IMPORTANT! PLEASE READ!! About the Google Adsense ads being displayed

    =====================
    Posted 08/15/2025
    =====================


    Yeah, I know. They are a pain in the butt. But they pay the bills to keep my server running. Just a fact of life, I am afraid.

    Want to get rid of them? Simple. Just become a Contributor level member or above and they will be gone. -> Please click HERE."

    Is that too much for me to ask of you to keep this site running? Well, sorry about that. I too wish I could get everything for free. But alas.....

    =====================
    Addendum: 01/10/2026
    =====================


    Google Adsense ad revenue for December, 2025 was just $30 over the cost of the lease for the server running this site. So, in effect, the money providing the incentive for me to continue running this site is coming SOLELY from the paid memberships and sponsorships here. Which honestly ain't much....

Venomoids, the right and the wrong.

adder said:
lucille - you have a point - we shouldn't be arguing.
Click to expand...

If what you are after is a conversation, you are correct.

adder said:
But what am I to do when I point out an obvious piece of
misinformation, only to have a bunch of argumentative people
changing the subject
Click to expand...

Well, if your goal is to have a conversation and not be a control freak, let people have their say. There are other opinions besides yours, and some of them may be equally or more valid. Listen.



adder said:
If you have any concern for the welfare of people, reptiles or the legitimate passtime of keeping snakes in boxes, redirect your anger towards those trying to stop the hobby and not the sometimes legit use of devenomized snakes for the snake's own welfare and/or public safety.
Click to expand...

See, there you go, trying to control again. I believe there is no good reason for venomoid surgery and that one is hurting the snake and asking for trouble by doing said surgery. My opinion is every bit a valid as yours, and by trying to control what I think, and what other people think, you are merely creating a justifiably poor rep for yourself.

You are trying to imply that because people have an opinion in this thread,they are not fighting the real fight. However, that is plainly erroneous as you too are here with your opinion.

A piece of advice, and it's free: Don't come out swinging and putting folks down. I mean really, if you do that, what did you expect in return?
 
Ray, i dont have a problem with venomoids like i said in previous post i use them but for you to say there is no danger you are ignorant. to say you and your staff take FULL responseability in the decline on death from snake bits there is being ignorant, big headed, and you are lying to yourselves. i never seen anyone in goldsboro nc with a snake til i came but for me to say i got everyone to get them would be stupid. 3) for you to use these snakes the way you do is stupid and is why bills like s373 are brought up because idiots cant handle snakes like an adult and treat them responsably. you my friend might need to get some education before you go trying to educate.
 
lucille said:
If what you are after is a conversation, you are correct.



Well, if your goal is to have a conversation and not be a control freak, let people have their say. There are other opinions besides yours, and some of them may be equally or more valid. Listen.





See, there you go, trying to control again. I believe there is no good reason for venomoid surgery and that one is hurting the snake and asking for trouble by doing said surgery. My opinion is every bit a valid as yours, and by trying to control what I think, and what other people think, you are merely creating a justifiably poor rep for yourself.

You are trying to imply that because people have an opinion in this thread,they are not fighting the real fight. However, that is plainly erroneous as you too are here with your opinion.

A piece of advice, and it's free: Don't come out swinging and putting folks down. I mean really, if you do that, what did you expect in return?
Click to expand...

:iagree:

Lucille you hit it right on the head with this one. we are all going to have our views and opinions and even though sometime things get heated in the rooms some of us still respect other views even though they are not our own. Ray you should take notes. its all about respect! good post Lucille
 
Lucille and strike-force-reptiles both take a deep breath and calm down.
I am not trying to control you.
I have already conceded your right to dislike venomoids and everyting about them.
Happy?
What I came to this thread about and my only reason was to correct obvious misinformation and/or lies on the said subject.
My original post noted the error of the claim that it was hard to differentiate muscle from organ tissue, given that false claim was used here as a basis to claim venomoids were not safe.
Venomoids by defnition are safe as they have no venom.
That's been established here for years and to the satisfaction of the worksafe authorities and the world's best vet surgeons and the numerous people who have volunteered to take bites from the said snakes!
So the claims and arguments against venomoids if legitimate, must move beyond the false claims that the operation is not possible (this was the original claim) and/or that venom gland regenerates, which we have established they don't.
Now you can have other objections against venomoids and they don't even have to make sense, but all I ask (and perhaps it's an impossible dream) is that you stick to facts and not lies.
ALL THE BEST:deadhorse:deadhorse:deadhorse:deadhorse:deadhorse:deadhorse
 
adder said:
Now you can have other objections against venomoids and they don't even have to make sense, but all I ask (and perhaps it's an impossible dream) is that you stick to facts and not lies.
Click to expand...

You just don't get it, do you. Your language is inflammatory and derogatory.
You are repeating your original opinions. There is in fact good information that counters your opinions, but you are not here to listen, and were not from the getgo. You are plainly intent on your performance, with all those horses, not on a dialogue, and certainly not the truth.

Who paid you? :rolleyes:
 
hey Ray try reading my posts, i said i agree with venomoids BUT venomoids are NOT 100% safe to do with like you do i dont care how you put it. you dont know when someone will screw up. i do remember someone on here ordered a hot from a company and got a venomoid so i wonder who ordered the venomoids that got the hot? might find out at the morgue. so see people do screw up and to tell everyone that venomoids are safe is wrong. free handling of a venomoid is stupid period. a dog has no venom but can you say a dog trained to attack is safe? venomous snake have and instinct to bite plain and simple, if someone screws up whats going to happen when the people gets bite while free handling a venomoid that someone screwed up? they are going to think ok its safe no venom and just clean it off and go on like it never happened while they are doing that by the time they realize somethings not right 70% will be too far from help and will die. also with venomoids you still run the risk of infection as well and the fangs could hit an artery which is very rare but there still is that chance. so no venomoids are not safe so you can keep arguing that they are but its bs and will just go right out the window. the facts are the facts and even though i use venomoids for real educational show i also stated that it is to lessen the risk of someone getting hurt i never said it was to make it safe. so i use them and i know the dangers. how about this you pull your head out of that warm dark hole its in and we will stop showing you all the ways you are ignorant. sound good?
 
adder said:
Try joining HSUS!
Click to expand...
Ahahahhahhhahhahhhahhahhhahhahha
Now THAT'S funny

btw, this is a discussion forum - you can stop with the shameless self promotion. (referring, of course, to the attached images/advertisements in posts 27 + 39)
 
People that scream I win I win are not sure of themselves.

Tell you what I gave you facts.

Fact: You abuse the snakes untill they bite you. There is no if ands or buts about it.

Fact: you cut into the head of venomous snakes so you can play with them in public.

Fact: You get upset when someone says that it can be done wrong. And it can be.
 
Gary O said:
People that scream I win I win are not sure of themselves.

Tell you what I gave you facts.

Fact: You abuse the snakes untill they bite you. There is no if ands or buts about it.

Fact: you cut into the head of venomous snakes so you can play with them in public.

Fact: You get upset when someone says that it can be done wrong. And it can be.
Click to expand...

:iagree:
 
I don't want to rain on anyones parade but the whole point of this thread was to try and promote the safe way of the procedure being done. We all know a lot of people perform the surgery that don't know what they are doing, or think they know but not licensed and certainly not a surgeon. For that reason i'd say the vast majority of "venomoids" are hard to consider safe, you guys are certainly right on that point.

But what i was trying to aim for was the snakes that do have the surgery done but licensed surgeons. the pain cared for pre and post surgery and possibly even implants put it place. I'd be very interested in seeing a study done one THOSE snakes to see if any ever become venomous again.
 
Back to the ... truth

Dear ScottyPimpin,

you said

"i'd say the vast majority of "venomoids" are hard to consider safe,"

Your view or opinion, but the fact is ALL venomoids are safe. The other snakes you refer to are not venomoids . . . simple realy.

Venomoid = No venom ...

You also wrote:

"I'd be very interested in seeing a study done one THOSE snakes to see if any ever become venomous again."

Well take it from somone whose done the said study over 8 years and guess what and with whatever expertise 8 years with venomoids brings?

Not one venomoid ever regenerated venom.

I am also sure that if I cut off your head, it also wouldn't regenerate.

Perhaps of relevance is that a paper is in preparation now for a peer reviewed journal on exactly what you speak of, and that is 8 years of venomoids.:deadhorse:deadhorse:deadhorse:deadhorse:deadhorse

We do also have papers on the subject at:
http://www.herp.net
which I assume all the venomoid "experts" here have read.

ALL THE BEST
 
Ray after the ignorant things you say and do no one is going to listen to what you have to say. so you my friend are pretty much the one :deadhorse by the way can you post your site? ild love to be able to show my wife so you can educate her on what NOT to do with a snake cause thats the only education you can really give. lol it would make more sense for you to bang ur head against a brick wall than to bang a snakes head against ur own head. let someone with more real info on this answer this guys question and just stay out of it
 
nothing is an exact science. i have been in emergency/critical care veterinary medicine now, almost 14 years. it has never, is not now, nor ever will be an exact science, no matter which way it is put or dealt with.
 
reticguy76 said:
nothing is an exact science. i have been in emergency/critical care veterinary medicine now, almost 14 years. it has never, is not now, nor ever will be an exact science, no matter which way it is put or dealt with.
Click to expand...

Bingo..........
 
::

reticguy76 said:
nothing is an exact science. i have been in emergency/critical care veterinary medicine now, almost 14 years. it has never, is not now, nor ever will be an exact science, no matter which way it is put or dealt with.
Click to expand...

:iagree:

To be an exact science one would have to make sure there is no room for human error and for a curve ball to be thrown by nature. No 2 snakes are exactly the same.

Also I hope not all Australians are as self center as the fella going on and on about how venomoid surgery is an exact science.

IMO I don't see a need for taking a snakes natural defenses away. And any company peddling the butchering of an animal for whatever reason is wrong in my book and only trying to get money at whatever cost. I just can't see it. But of course I will be labeled wrong so I don't really care.

So while we are taking the defenses from animals I think I will go have a doctor lop off my iguanas tail, take out its teeth, and remove it's claws or better yet have my cats toes cut off so they won't scratch me when they play with me.

Point is you make a decision when buying or obtaining a hot if you as a person are incapable of handling or knowing the proper way of handling them then you should not have them. They didn't ask to live at your house you forced them to be there so as a responsible owner it is your job first and foremost to make sure YOU can handle them. If not move onto something you are not so afraid of or can handle properly.

So :censored: that surgery and :censored: that company who does it and :censored: anyone who supports it.

Oh yeah and that is just stupid performing a surgery at a show. way to be :censored: sterile the ignorant mother:censored: needs to have their :censored: ripped off and shoved in their :censored: they probably signed that snakes death certificate by doing that. Some surgeries are just NOT necessary.
 
Oh my bad I read it wrong. that sentence looks weird to me. Anyway FREE HANDLING venomoid snakes at a show is just as ignorant.
 
Back
Top