Info Yaz Mansour and the dead Boa

[DaveyFig]

I don't think either seller or buyer are bad guys from the deal.. but neither is behaving very professionally during this frustrating time. would help?

I agree with every part of your post except for this one sentence. I don't see anywhere that David has acted unprofessionally at all.

 

[lanceheads]

also, I don't know if this has been pointed out, but Pneuomia doesn't manifest itself within 2 1/2 days.
The animal was obviously sick before you shipped it. Snakes are great at masking illness, until it's too late to catch it.

Randal Berry

 

[Dennis Hultman]

The animal is now disposed of from what you told me, so honestly there arent any more pictures you can send me, no proof that this was even done, and on top of that if you did get a necropsy done I dont even know if that may have been my boa that got the procedure done because you dont have paperwork for anything.

The question should be, what has he done here to suspect that he would be untruthful about it? Up to this point he has stated nothing about you that one would think you were deceitful, he hasn't labeled you a "bad guy", he hasn't stated that you knowingly sent out sick animals. In all honesty, he is still speaking highly of you (at least up to this point) and stating he understands your questions and desire to know what has happened here.

In return, you have accused him or suggest just about everything about him. You have suggested that he has lied about everything including that it was a different snake in the pictures. What did he do, (besides the snake dieing) to suggest such things?

 

[Dennis Hultman]

Good morning all. Well, it looks like some of the comments have gone if the direction I feared they would when you take something like this public. Yaz, enough with the "David didnt call me exactly when he received it." I always open up the animals and get them taken care of before I jump on the phone. Why would I call you when I havent even opened the box. I am sorry that the UPS man took the easy route and wrote "garage". That is where I met him so we wouldnt have to carry a 40 lb box that far and I didnt want the box tossed around any more than it had to. I have done this many a times with plenty of high end dragons. My reputation speaks for itself.

Yes, I didnt call you until Th. right around 48 hours after receiving the boa. The symptoms didnt start getting extremely concerning until then. Hindsight is 20/20.

For all you that are asking "what's the rush, why dont you wait until the report comes back?" I say, whats the difference? What would be happening right now had I not gone immediately to the diagnostic lab?? I can only imagine. I am the one that decided to get the necropsy done. I WILL provide that report once I receive it but why should I have to wait and go through more drama as the seller digs and brainstorms for any loophole he can conjure up? If something silly comes back on the report contrary to what I was told by the DVM's on Friday, I will quickly be a man and refund the money paid back to me. I am not even asking for the full amount. I think I am being very understanding of the confusion and frustration that Yaz must be feeling on his end. Its tough on everyone. He and I talked this thing through plenty of time since Friday. Twice he agreed with me and told me he would pay me back and that it all made sense once he was able to talk it through with me. Only to have him change his mind within a couple of hours and not pay me back. Part of this is the natural process of him trying to understand all of this and to make sure that nothing was done on this end to cause the death. I dont blame him for that part. But, now you have to listen to the third party, independent vets that do this sort of thing all of the time. They are the trained professionals in all of this. None of us are.

I think it is sad how the level of trust has gone down between good people in this country. The days when you could look someone in the eyes as you shook hands are gone for the most part. Now, most just sit behind a keyboard and flex their muscles.

Hey Yaz, If anything these statements of his this morning were anything but accusatory and it seems he is understanding of your position and your need to know. But honestly,

Honor? I SENT a perfect HEALTHY animal. He RECEIVED a perfect HEALTHY animal. I didnt hear from him for 2 1/2 days. Then all of a sudden the snake is sick and then died the following day?

I know the quality of my animals, I am not questioning myself, he was healthy, arrived healthy, was perfectly fine for 2 1/2 days and then just got sick and died. You can see the pics of the ad and tell he was a perfectly healthy animal and he arrived that way. I dont need to prove anything, he is the one that needs to prove to ME that the snake didnt die because of him. Why am I going to issue ANY refund if there is no proof of anything on how that snake died? All I know is the snake was healthy, arrived healthy (and he stated that himself, and was saying how perfect the boa was) and then didnt hear from him for days. The all of a sudden 3 days later got sick and died the next day. Thats not a question for me, thats a question for him.

Yaz, Let's just conclude all that you stated above is true. Then why did you offer to pay any refund? Did you not offer to send him a refund twice before seeing the necropsy report? You raised some good questions about the soaking and that was one of the first things I was going to ask when I noticed this thread last night but you had already agreed that you were going to send him a refund, correct?
He has gone out of his way to state that he understands all the information you are concerned about, but hasn't faulted you for the boa's heath and even states that you probably wouldn't have even know it was sick.
On your side, you first offered to send payment, minus shipping or close to it, correct? Then you agreed to $250, correct? You then made allegations that it isn't the same snake, correct? When that is disproved, and it was, you now are stating your buyer might be a liar and might have not been home all day, correct? In return he still doesn't state that you know you sent him a sick snake and has been very amicable accept on the point that you already offered two separate refunds then backed out.
Is this correct or am I missing something?

Look, I understand wanting to know what happened to your animal. I don't understand why you now automatically think that your buyer is not telling the truth about everything. I don't think he has given you reason to be as accusatory in your accusations. I would ask the same question about cleaning the tank beforehand, the soaking and husbandry at the start. You seemed to take his word in the beginning so why do we keep leavling more accusations. It makes it seem has though we are trying to find anything to discredit your buyer, when there is no need.

All of this has been implied by you. Paraphrasing here.

The snake isn't the same. More or less the buyer is a scam. What indications or what had he done to even deserve such a allegation before you took the time to compare the pictures? Others did it for you here. Why wouldn't you take the time to do so before putting the allegation out there?

Well he didn't immediately call me and it states delivered by "garage". He didn't do the transaction the way I do it so it should void any guarantee.
You talked to him within one hour of delivery time. He stated all was well. Less than an hour isn't nowhere unreasonable to get back to you. I understand being concerned and calling when it states "garage" I do. But it is reasonable what he stated and all honestly why would you think he was lying? What did he do for you now to statee that maybe he wasn't home? What has he lied about that warrants now calling him a liar, again? I check my animals out, set them up then send the seller a note. Nothing unreasonable about the time frame. Again, I understand the concern of tracking stating "garage" and you knew this before you offered to pay the partial refund twice, correct?

"I didn't get pictures or a report from the necropsy. Even though, I agreed to a refund and stated he need not do it because I know the expense. "

With all due respect, you seem to be grasping at anything and everything to paint the buyer in a bad light when he has done nothing of the sort to you. The snake is dead. That is the fact. He stated he would provide the report. I see no reason to not believe him at this point. It is reasonable to want to find out why the snake died and if there is the possibility that is the buyers fault, but I don't think it reasonable to suggest that he is a thief and a liar at this point.

 

[john_]

I don't know anyone on this board in person and would ask ANYONE for data when it comes to an exchange of money in a he said/she said type of deal. Yaz (as far as I know) isn't a wal-mart. You don't walk in with a receipt and get your money back. It's 100% not unreasonable to ask for some proof when you have little doubt you sent out a healthy snake. The reports could tell all, why keep up with the speculation?

If i was in the buyers position I certainly would have gotten every piece of evidence to back up my claims, photos, receipts, reports. Isn't that the logical? His goal is to get his money back why not just make it easy on himself?

 

[john_]

Crap, did it again, John Graziani to the above

 

[Randall Turner]

Yaz, I feel like I've gotten to know you fairly well on TRR, and believe you to be an honest person who is looking at this situation and reading too much into it. I don't believe anyone on here read the OPs post as an attack toward your keeping ability or toward you personally, and see it as an unfortunate situation that frankly could have happened to anyone on here. What is important is how you respond to the curveballs that are thrown your way, this being one of them. I believe it is in your best interest to issue a full refund, even though it will be a hit in the pocketbook by eating the shipping.

 

[Dennis Hultman]

If i was in the buyers position I certainly would have gotten every piece of evidence to back up my claims, photos, receipts, reports. Isn't that the logical? His goal is to get his money back why not just make it easy on himself?

I don't disagree that all of that is important, which it is to most sellers and buyers should understand that but, Did he not first suggest that he not and agreed to send him a refund, twice? I could be wrong but isn't that presented here?

 

[DaveyFig]

I don't know anyone on this board in person and would ask ANYONE for data when it comes to an exchange of money in a he said/she said type of deal. Yaz (as far as I know) isn't a wal-mart. You don't walk in with a receipt and get your money back. It's 100% not unreasonable to ask for some proof when you have little doubt you sent out a healthy snake. The reports could tell all, why keep up with the speculation?

If i was in the buyers position I certainly would have gotten every piece of evidence to back up my claims, photos, receipts, reports. Isn't that the logical? His goal is to get his money back why not just make it easy on himself?

The vets have already stated that the snake had pneumonia. That doesn't take a full necropsy and days of waiting. It had pneumonia. The cause (viral or bacterial) is unknown.That is what the wait is for. The snake did have pneumonia, and that wasn't caused by temps that were too high, or 2 1/2 days of living with David.

 

[munchkin1020]

You know I just read through this post and I'm going to have to say, Yaz it looks like you are digging yourself a hole and pulling the dirt in on you. I'm going to have to say I know David well and can say he is a man of his word. I've been to his facilities and his husbandtry skills are good, i've also bought a good many animals from him with great success. I will say he told you he will get you the report as soon as he gets it but you don't seem to want to read it before you question his integrity. Your questioning his integrity and he is some what taking up for you and saying he didn't think you did this on purpose. I would jump on the 250 refund because when the report comes back I would ask for a total refund plus vet bills. You keep harping on the overheated issue, if some of David's equipment failed and overheated the snake I have no doubt David would say its my fault. You need to quit bashing David and come to a conclusion.
Quit getting so defensive and upset till the report comes back, that way you don't have so much to apologize for when you read it.

 

[sarabellum]

Just to let you guys know, UPS fucks up all the time. I got a dragon in a couple weeks ago from Dan @ Outback Dragons and I met the guy in my driveway and picked up the dragon and later on the UPS thing actually said "Left at back door" and I was really confused. So, I guess they don't always leave the correct information. Also, I live about 3 hours from David and I was JUST at his house buying some bearded dragons during the weekend of the raleigh reptile expo (the weekend before he purchased this boa) and he did not have a snake like this or anything like this at all in his shed (where he keeps his bearded dragons and snakes) so I would have seen another snake if that wasn't the same one in the picture. He didn't have another snake that looked anywhere near like it, so the boa that came in the monday after I was there had to be the one. I go to David's all the time and we're pretty good friends. I'm positive I would know if he had another snake similar to this one. The picture is definitely of the snake he just bought. That's just my 2 cents.

 

[sarabellum]

I would jump on the 250 refund because when the report comes back I would ask for a total refund plus vet bills.

 

[Yaz23]

Look, I'm sorry for accusing anything towards David. He is a great guy and seems like he knows what he's doing. I told him several times though I wanted to see the report before I would send a refund. He kept saying "lets get this over with and just issue the refund and be done with it". I dont want to refund anything until I see the report. I dont believe anyones "word" I need documents, thats how I am. I could easily say "my vet or vet's say this, so I want a refund" I could be lying and no one would know. ANYONE could easily say that or here the words of the vet incorrectly or just change them completely. Therefore, I want documents stating that was his cause of death not words passed to me with no evidence.

 

[john_]

The vets have already stated that the snake had pneumonia. That doesn't take a full necropsy and days of waiting. It had pneumonia. The cause (viral or bacterial) is unknown.That is what the wait is for. The snake did have pneumonia, and that wasn't caused by temps that were too high, or 2 1/2 days of living with David.

Yaz's vet said it was perfectly healthy. Catch my drift? Data!

 

[Payara]

I respect both of you. You both have amazing animals and are nice people. Yaz why don't you just give the vet a call like David suggested? David don't you have any proof you took the animal to vet, I think it would be a good idea to post that up.

 

[tinmantribe5]

Yaz please dont take Offense how about you refund the purchase price and see if David will Bite the Shipping then everybody feels a little bit of Redemtion?

 

[Rainbowboaman]

Everyone seems to be taking sides here.
I'm trying to look at this thread from both the buyer & sellers view. Think about if you shipped out a snake that you have had for 2 years & within 3 days of arrival it is dead & the buyer is demanding a refund. You are already upset that the snake died & you wonder if you put it in the wrong hands, let alone are you refunding money for something that wasn't your fault or out of your hands. I would also wonder why the buyer only wants $250.00 back.
As the buyer you can only think that you were shipped a sick snake & be upset & feel like you were ripped off & left to deal with sick snake. That is the same snake in pics & any more comment made before the results is just speculation & we might as wait for definative POSTED results & then find the solution to this.

 

[tinmantribe5]

I would not want to drag this out it should have been sqaushed Page1!
My Reputation and being able to use this tool to its fulliest is More important than 300 bucks! Yaz It doesnt matter even if you dont have the Monry set up a reasonable repayment plan then sqaush this in a PM or Email

 

[KelliH]

Dean, my gurantees on sales are, Live arrival gurantee. However I only gurantee that if the buyer calls me IMMEDIATELY after delivery.

The death of the snake falls outside the guarantee time, therefore I feel Yaz is well within his right to ask for a copy of a vet report, and/or necropsy reports.

 

[tinmantribe5]

Lets say there was no Autopsy "Who would be right then?