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Bad business practices

I can't believe it

I can't belive that you guys have nothing better to do than sit at your computer and talk Sh!t about people you don't even know.
How long have you been keeping hots, Seamus? Myself, 10 years. And i have never, nore do i plan to be bit.So thanks for the thrashing guys, i guess you really put me in my place. AND PLEASE DON"T POST ANYTHING YOU WANT ME TO SEE I WON"T BE BACK.
 
Re: Ok

cobras111 said:
Well sorry Steve. Some of us obviously aren't as educated and as wise as you. Didn't see you interjecting much.
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I haven't interjected further because I am waiting to hear from one of my contacts as to a suspicion I have.

Anyone care to guess what it is? Recently there has been a letterwriting campaign protesting the treatment of animals in a Pet Store in UPSTATE NEW YORK.
 
And what do you know, I found the thread I was looking for:
http://forum.kingsnake.com/lgecko/messages/140671.html

15869leos(Small)-med.jpg


http://www.upstateexotics.com/index.htm
 
"I can't belive that you guys have nothing better to do than sit at your computer and talk **** about people you don't even know."


So then, may we assume that you know veronica and/or Jon? If so, how do you know them/him/her? It may very well make the tenor of you postings understandable. If you do not know one or either of them, does that not make you a HUGE hypocrite?

You still haven't addressed the points we raised to you, Sir. Oh, but wait! You DID say, "PLEASE DON"T POST ANYTHING YOU WANT ME TO SEE I WON"T BE BACK." OK . . .THAT answered all our questions didn't it?

Actually it did.

:flamethr:

Woo-Hoo! THAT was fun!
 
Cry me a river, Tommy boy. I can assure you that you won't be missed, as you have neither contributed anything intelligent, nor been able to consistently follow a very simple rule.

AND IF SOME LADY POSTED FALSE THINGS ABOUT ME THAT COULD POSSIBLY HURT MY BUISNESS< YOU BETTER BELIEVE I WOULD BE CALLING HER AS% WHENEVER I FOUND OUT ABOUT IT, 12pm or 3:30 am. No i take that back, i would have my lawyer call.
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Yeah, it might be a good idea to let a lawyer handle it, as you've demonstrated a severe ignorance of the law whan it comes to matters such as this.

I think it great fun. This is the first day that i have visited this site. Mainly cause this venomous forum sucks.
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I'm glad we can provide insignificant little trolls such as yourself some entertainment. I can say it hasn't been one-sided... your ignorance has provided me with a good laugh. I realize I should feel guilty about finding amusement in the mental deficiencies of others, but it's just so much fun!:D

I even had doubts about registering, and now i see why. I think there is one major problem with this forum.
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Well, the registration doubts can probably be attributed to your extreme mastery of the English language.

However, your decision to leave has removed the "one major problem".

It is actually kind of childish, i have felt a noticeable drop in my i.q. in the last 4 hours.
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Yes, Tommy boy, someone will comment about that. I find it hard to believe that your iq can drop any lower. You've demonstrated a severe ignorance of the topics that you comment on. In addition, your posts reek of either illiteracy or laziness.

I can't belive that you guys have nothing better to do than sit at your computer and talk Sh!t about people you don't even know.
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Hmmm, have you ever heard a statement along the lines of pot...kettle...black?

As I said before, if you post gross misinformation and idiotic comments, expect to be taken to task for it. Then again, some people just can't seem to handle criticism.

How long have you been keeping hots, Seamus? Myself, 10 years. And i have never, nore do i plan to be bit.
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Ten years...I'm envious. Well, not really. After all, I've been keeping them for thirteen years.

For the record, most people who are bitten don't plan on it. There comes a point in time when even the most seasoned among us makes a mistake. Whether or not the snake capitalizes on that mistake is a matter of luck. The posibility of envenomation can be minimized, but it still remains.
 
Ken, I could not have said it better myself

I'm glad we can provide insignificant little trolls such as yourself some entertainment. I can say it hasn't been one-sided... your ignorance has provided me with a good laugh. I realize I should feel guilty about finding amusement in the mental deficiencies of others, but it's just so much fun!
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Do come back Mr. Elwood, thought you liked sarcasism?:D
I personally will miss your intellect and input here:(
Does the same Jon own up state exotic pets? Jon Dvoretz?
Jon if you are still lurking please tell me what is up with that iguanas face that you are selling for 100.00?
 
Rozann, my understanding is that this Jon character wholesales to Upstate Exotics (Alison Tornambene)

Upstate Exotics apparently is not the pinnacle of proper husbandry. Although it wouldn't be a surprise if many of the animals that have recently been complained about are from Jon.
 
Thank you Steven for filling me in. I have been trying to go over old threads to find out what is going on. I wouldn't want to post with out knowing what is going on.

:) Rozann Lamont
 
OK, I read this entire thread...

..before I decided to post anything. I'm going to stick my 50 cents worth in here, just because I, presently, do NOT have anything else to do right now....

~Why was it so tough for Veronica to just post her issues with the delivery and communications, naming the seller, and leave it at that?

~Is it possible that she posted what she did and PURPOSELY did not name the seller, knowing that she would get numerous requests to do so? Been known to happpen.

~ FYI ( and I am sure many "seasoned ' breeders/shippers know this) There are even 60 hour heat packs. In fact that is what I use no matter what. Last week they managed to get a juvenile BD as well as an adult BD to their destination safely and comfortably. ( I live in New england..and we ALL know how cold it has been here!)

~ Fat tails? Lots of money??? Maybe I missed it, but did the actual price of the geckos ever appear? Though geckos are not my specialty, I do have breed some and I have never seen fat-tails that were expensive.

~If there was investigation being done by federal agents, I think the people at PayPal would have some notion of it. If the "FBI" and "IRS" were truly checking transactions on Payal, they would probably be aware of the nature of the purchase. For the most part, there are usually memos to accompany the money sent.

~ Sorry, Veronica, to trust anyone calling you on the phone and saying they were FBI is a bit past naive. Especially the part about not getting a name or number? Before you took your photo off, you didn't look THAT young? And a disability does not count as an explanation unless it is of a psychological nature.


I got so tired of just doing my multiple sclerosis support group and research that it was down right depressing. This group has cheared me up and giving me more in life than just my chat line and kids.
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~ Sorry if this sounds cold, but this blatant bid for sympathy bothers me. I probably would not have even bothered posting had I not seen this. Having been a nurse for many, MANY years, I have met a number of people with disabilities...including MS. There are 4 different "forms" of the disease and I know people who have dealt with, and succumbed, to the toughest ones. I had tremendous respect for the majority of these people...most of whom would never use their diagnosis or condition to elicit pity when they realized they were in over their heads.
I could go one forever on this, but I will let it drop as it is not appropriate for this forum.

~ Lastly, the thread on KS does make this whole thing look a little shady. A sort of, roundabout way of attempting to destroy a targeted reputation. This, too has been known to happen.


'Nuff said.
jude fitch
 
This is really getting very petty.

I never attacked Veronica for nothing more than the fact that she was speading things about the FBI looking into Next World Exotics. She apologized and this thread should be dead. And whether there was a legitimate claim with Jon is only what she and Jon know of, I was simply posting to explain my experiences with the person...I had thought that was what this site was all about. Apparently I was very wrongly mistaken. For me posting about my experiences with Jon's company I am now the center of attention for Steve.


Steve, in regards to that link that you sent. Those pictures were of leopard geckos I so have. All of our animals get quantined when they come into us. We bought them from a local store where they were worse off than they are with me. They are not mistreated, they are not dehydrated...They are alot better off here with us. We have a vet that comes in to check all of our new animals. And now my entire store consists "unproper husbandry" which I find quite commical. I was wondering how many people out there in the reptile world will tell you that they have NEVER had an animal that is on the thin side.....

It just hurts to know that people who have never dealt with us have such negative things to say about us. Every customer we have had has been extremely happy with our animals, our care and the way with deal with people in general.

In other posts I have read, people come to this site looking to find out about businesses that people have had EXPERIENCE dealing with. I have never done business with anyone here and suddenly I am the center of some negative posts.

Steve, I don't appreciate being drawn down into this whirlwind. Suddenly you find me to be the center of your attacks...since you have already commented on almost anyone esle who has posted something here. We have never done business together...and maybe we will or maybe we won't. But until you come see our facility, the care of our animals or any other part of our business and know exactly who were are there is no need for you to post regarding us. If you choose do to business with us, then feel free to post all you'd like on your experiences.
 
UpstateExotics1 said:
This is really getting very petty.

I never attacked Veronica for nothing more than the fact that she was speading things about the FBI looking into Next World Exotics. She apologized and this thread should be dead. And whether there was a legitimate claim with Jon is only what she and Jon know of, I was simply posting to explain my experiences with the person...I had thought that was what this site was all about. Apparently I was very wrongly mistaken. For me posting about my experiences with Jon's company I am now the center of attention for Steve.
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Your reputation is an important gauge as to how credible your post in support of Jon is. I do not feel it was out of line.

Steve, in regards to that link that you sent. Those pictures were of leopard geckos I so have. All of our animals get quantined when they come into us. We bought them from a local store where they were worse off than they are with me. They are not mistreated, they are not dehydrated...They are alot better off here with us. We have a vet that comes in to check all of our new animals. And now my entire store consists "unproper husbandry" which I find quite commical. I was wondering how many people out there in the reptile world will tell you that they have NEVER had an animal that is on the thin side.....
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That particular picture was taken from an ad you posted, offering the geckos in question for sale. How noble of you to sell off those poor rescue animals.

Steve, I don't appreciate being drawn down into this whirlwind. Suddenly you find me to be the center of your attacks...since you have already commented on almost anyone esle who has posted something here. We have never done business together...and maybe we will or maybe we won't. But until you come see our facility, the care of our animals or any other part of our business and know exactly who were are there is no need for you to post regarding us. If you choose do to business with us, then feel free to post all you'd like on your experiences.
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I have made honest observations, I am not going down a list of people to attack like you suggest.
 
OK, where do I start?
First off I do agree with Jude about the disability used as a tool, there may be other problems like meds that may get in the way as well though.
Second, I have heard from both parties individually. Although I won't disclose all they wrote, (just not me, and not up to me) I will say some things.
1. the (whats important to me) the geckos are fine now and eating. They needed warmth. (no I don't know about the heat pack)
2. Jon did admit that he has other pressing personal matters and neglected to call her as to when they were going to be shipped.
3. She states that the box was just marked perishable and has saved the box for the picture she says she will post tomorrow.
4. From what I have heard from Jon he really does want this matter settled, call me naive but I believe him.

I believe I am going to bow out of this as I seem to now be in the middle. I have asked both to post and possibly resolve this.
I say in open post I hope they do and post if they do. As a lot of people read these (take a look at the numbers from just one day)
Or at least write to each other privately and then just a quick note if it is resolved. :)
To Mr. Elwood, I hope I get the chance someday to converse with you again, it was lovely chatting with you and swapping sarcasisms.
Oh and by the way, I happen to also think this is a great forum:D
Rozann Lamont
 
Also,

Sal & Alison Tornambene

Upstate Exotics
PO Box 119
Cossayuna, NY 12823
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Do you have an address outside of a PO Box or does your facilty reside at the Post Office?

I live in New York and would love to see this store of yours.
 
Steve, we'd love to have you come take a look. Feel free to call me at 866-PETS-499 and I can give you directions.

We are upstate, by the Vermont border. From Long Island, where you are, we are about 4-5 hours. It's about a 250 mile drive from the Island.
 
I have spoken to Jon as well. We chatted online for sometime as well as on the phone today for a few minutes.
Although I still won't 100% trust him with my money at this point, he definitely wants to straighten things out with my friend and I, and I do believe that he will do what he can. I will keep you guys updated on what goes on, but judging by the feeling I got, I think it will eventually be okay.

I also want to retract this statement I made earlier...

The only things I know about Jon doing illegally in the animal trade was that he was selling primates and other exotic mammals and that some of the deals he did weren't exactly all about the law(he provided this info to me back when he and I were talking regularly).
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I honestly remembered the conversation incorrectly. Jon and I spoke about this today and we rehashed all our past conversations as best we could, and figured out what I had gotten misconstrued was a situation with a game officer that didn't like him and was constantly hounding him. Hopefully making a statement like this off of a fractured memory will not ruin my credibility, but if so, I can totally understand and I apologize if I mislead anyone(it was not intentional). And just so everyone knows, NO Jon did not pressure me or give me threatening calls or anything like that. I simply didn't remember the conversation correctly and I wanted let everyone know this.

As far as this situation with Veronica, I don't really believe everything she has said as alot of it is really farfetched(FBI caling your house? Come on!). However, I do feel Jon should at least come here to answer the somewhat legitimate gripes she had about the shipping issue. But Veronica, how are the geckos doing now? I don't recall you ever answering that, and if they are doing fine, I guess there isn't THAT much to gripe about other than Jon didn't inform you of the shipping date, which if this is ACTUALLY true, is a legitimate concern.

But I am VERY curious to know who the mysterious "Venom/Tom Ellwood" character is. Something does not sit right at all with that person. His only purpose was to troll this thread it seems....hmmmmm.....
 
Now now Rob, we must get the spelling right, that is Elwood with one L.;)
I do not trust him either, did you happen to ask Jon about knowing him? I did but did not get an answer.
I do believe it can be worked out and encouraged them both to get on here and straighten it out, both were in the wrong, I posted above yours that she (Veronica) said that the geckos are fine now and eating as of today.
Since both have some wrongs and rights it shouldnt be too hard to straighten out. Keeping fingers crossed.

Rozann Lamont
 
I would very much like to see this settled here. As for Tom Elwood, he says he won't be coming back, but I think we all know he has read every response to this, and is probably foaming at the mouth he wants to respond so bad.

At the very least, I am hopeing to hear about this situation being resolved, and wish both parites luck towards that end.
 
aft's

as for the question of prices for aft's
normals and stripes i've found run from 25 to 60 depending on age and if they are stripes or normals
albinos which is what i got from jon... run from 150 to 200 each
orange stripes are 100 to 200 or more
amelanistics start at 100 for hets and up to 400 or more.
i have all but the amelanistics.
once i get my digital camera working i will satisfy everyones curiosity as to the box.
just wanted to adress the issue of the person who said something about not seeing or was it not knowing what an AFT costs.
I also collect leo's but they are so common that the prices are much lower than most AFT's other than the normals.
Colorful AFT's are harder to find but are gaining in popularity.
Veronica Davidson
 
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