Tentative list of membership options.

[WebSlave]

Ok...some very valid points!
What if there was some sort of compromise, and you changed it so that anyone could at least view the BOI but not everyone could post?

I thought everyone already knew that this was the way I am going to do it? Didn't I post that table of permissions and such earlier in this thread? Did I make a mistake in it concerning this particular detail?

Also on another note (and this is just my humble opinion) We all know that you are getting burned out on all that has to be done at fauna, I Think I sorta know what you are going thru, (having run a 12,000 sq ft Retail store for 25 years and getting so burned out that I basically just closed it in So. CAl. & moved to N. Idaho)...Wheeeew!!! Anyway I think there are things that you could do to streamline your responsibilities! To make your life more "manageable" And there is one definite thing I see as a waste (remember in my opinion....it could be a huge money maker...I seriously doubt it) GET RID of some things first and foremost HerpWantAds! Other things may be the new classifieds...either switch to the new completely or dump it! It's just to confusing, not to mention time consuming to go through all these. ONE OR THE OTHER!!! Im sure there are other things that you may have been thinking about! Look the less you have to think about when you wake up each morning the less drain of time and energy it is on you!

All in due time. I like to see how the new system goes over with users before deciding on whether to drop the forum based one or not. I don't like running both of them either, but I think a gradual transition is better then just pulling the rug out from under everyone.

Now in saying that I really don't give a rats ass what you do I will pay whatever, because I know it's worth it....I've been here!!!! It's the new people that you have to worry about, they are the ones that will continue to keep Fauna going...you will always need new blood.....think about it it's like breeding reptiles!!!

That is one of the main reasons I decided to keep the BOI readable to non-paying members. They need to be able to see what it is that they would be paying for. Along those same lines, I suspect the success or failure in the near term of this site may very well rest on the people who do pay for memberships being encouraging to the undecideds to follow suit. $10 isn't all that much money, but just about everyone could find something else to spend that money on instead of here. I have tried the search engine traffic machines before, and you spend a lot of money getting people to come to your site one time and then going on elsewhere. It is really only through word of mouth recommendations and guidance from current members that gives people visiting a reason to stay.

I really wish more people would spend time in the discussion forums, as that is really needed to get people to stick here. The BOI is the hotspot on this site, but it gets old after a while. But I have seen questions posted on the discussion forums that even after MONTHS, went unanswered by anyone. That is what frustrates people trying to get conversations started. They feel ignored and then just don't bother posting anything. But I just don't have any good ideas how to change things for the better there. I've tried free sponsorships for people, rearranged the forums to make them more accessible, am trying paid sponsorships now, thinking that people paying to sponsor a forum might be inclined to try to pursuade traffic to do there. So heck, I don't know. Maybe charging to post on the BOI will get some people posting elsewhere. Who knows?

 

[Intense Herpetoculture]

I've been trying to spark up a few of the other forums with mild success as for late. As more people post, more will come, just takes a little jump start. I mean, look what me and Kelli did with the leo forum!

 

[WebSlave]

I've been trying to spark up a few of the other forums with mild success as for late. As more people post, more will come, just takes a little jump start. I mean, look what me and Kelli did with the leo forum!

Yeah man! Believe me, I have noticed. All it takes is a couple of people and apparently they can work miracles. But heck, I am just as guilty, I suppose. You would think I would spend some time trying to get the corn snake forum rolling along. So I can't complain about every one else now can I?

 

[Intense Herpetoculture]

I'll keep trying to spice up the numbers of posts in the forums as much as I can, quality posts that is. I really want to see this site succed and will do what I can do have this happen. It should be interesting to see where this site goes when the paid membership kicks in. Guess we'll have to wait and see. The change is well intended, that's all that matters. It is going to be put in place to make this website better, and I'm happy to see that. Just as long as you are moving in a positive direction, I don't care what you do.

Yeah man! Believe me, I have noticed. All it takes is a couple of people and apparently they can work miracles. But heck, I am just as guilty, I suppose. You would think I would spend some time trying to get the corn snake forum rolling along. So I can't complain about every one else now can I?

 

[riverjop]

(quote from webslave)I thought everyone already knew that this was the way I am going to do it? Didn't I post that table of permissions and such earlier in this thread? Did I make a mistake in it concerning this particular detail?

Rich I was just going off the chart on this thread that you made....sorry if I missed any add ons/corrections!

I really think the $10 or even $25 is inconsequential to most regulars that come here...I mean hey $10 is like a meal & a half at McDonald !
It's just the new person who doesn't really know what this site has to offer and how informative it can be...that would worry me! I wonder what I would have done the first time I came on here if I was blocked out of "shut out" I really don't know? Just think how much quieter it would be around here! LOL awww but now your stuck with me!

Is it possible for you to reqognise a new IP and that new IP would have say????? 7 days of free things then it would kick in to the "paying" schedule? Maybe an automatic e-mail would go out to inform them? I don't know how these things work....just a thought!

 

[mycurlylocks]

Maybe I shouldn’t say anything, but here goes anyway!!! I am a hobbyist, so maybe I can show a different view from the professionals. I don’t post very often, but I enjoy most of the site.

How about using an opening page, so when a person visits the site, it will display the rules? Many forums display rules first and then you get into the “real stuff”. The opening page should have the information as to how to pay for membership. I think the table you posted should be more than adequate to show someone their options. Once a member logs in, the cookies could allow them to bypass this page.

My next suggestion would be to clean out the database. Geez, there are people that have posted only one time, years ago. I would implement an annual database check and discard old registrations. If they are interested in posting again, they can re-register. Current members should be responsible enough to update their own information. Most sites I use require me to update my information at least once a year. There is no sense in wasting a webmaster’s time with obsolete information.

I would like to see the classifieds more consolidated and set a time limit on them. I hate quickly scanning the ads to only find out it is several months old. I know I should be more careful, but it does get frustrating. You might want to consider allowing people to buy classified ads, but not to post anything else. Some hobbyists would like to sell their pets, but not get involved in the postings.

Rich, I realize this site is a lot of work for you and that it is a PRIVILEGE. Not only is it the expenses, the time dedicated is valuable also. I have no problems paying a membership fee, even though I am a casual user.

Now you will have a new headache. Will you send out courtesy reminders when it is time to renew our memberships? Without it, I might get blacklisted!

My last bit of input is, please members, share your wealth of knowledge and post in the discussion forums. So much energy is used on the BOI, but not in the discussions. I got so frustrated trying to get help or discussions going, that I gave up. Not all of us are retailers, we are hobbyists that need help or would just like to discuss things. I think allowing minors to the discussions would be great. Young people can present fresh ideas and they need to gain experience from the best influences possible.

Thanks for hearing me out,
Candy King

 

[Wraith]

Well that is an incredibly simple answer. If you don't need to post in the BOI, nor in any of the other forums and classifieds that require a $10 payment, then you don't need to pay for a paid membership.

I never said I don't post on the BOI - just that it has not saved me any money.


Adrian

 

[WebSlave]

Sorry, but no. For a couple of reasons. One reason is that now anyone even moderately fluent on the web can install a program or use a website that will spoof their IP address. IP addresses are mostly useless for identifying someon, and it really is only the newbies at web tech stuff that get caught that way.

So with that in mind, the credibility check of the paid memberships to keep the multiple logins and false ID postings on the BOI would be completely neutralized if I allowed that 7 day trial period. Most of them only post a couple of times, then they are gone anyway. So no, that would defeat one of the major reasons behind this whole plan.

 

[WebSlave]

Maybe I shouldn’t say anything, but here goes anyway!!! I am a hobbyist, so maybe I can show a different view from the professionals. I don’t post very often, but I enjoy most of the site.

Heck, I opened up this discussion(s) because I wanted feedback. I never put any restrictions on who could lend a hand.

How about using an opening page, so when a person visits the site, it will display the rules? Many forums display rules first and then you get into the “real stuff”. The opening page should have the information as to how to pay for membership. I think the table you posted should be more than adequate to show someone their options. Once a member logs in, the cookies could allow them to bypass this page.

That isn't a bad idea. But implementing it probably couldn't take place before the actual implementation of the plan itself. Maybe, though. There is an area of the screen highlighted in yellow at the top that changes depending on what user group you are. I'm not sure how much capability I can squeeze in there though. Thanks!

My next suggestion would be to clean out the database. Geez, there are people that have posted only one time, years ago. I would implement an annual database check and discard old registrations. If they are interested in posting again, they can re-register. Current members should be responsible enough to update their own information. Most sites I use require me to update my information at least once a year. There is no sense in wasting a webmaster’s time with obsolete information.

Actually cleaning out the database would take up more of my time then just leaving it be. I have thought about doing that MANY times, but it is a bit more complicated then you would think. One sticky problem is that I can't really delete any user who has ever posted on the BOI. So I would have to check each and every one who has at least ONE posted message to make sure it wasn't on the BOI. I'm sure you can see what a pain in the butt that would be to do.....

I would like to see the classifieds more consolidated and set a time limit on them. I hate quickly scanning the ads to only find out it is several months old. I know I should be more careful, but it does get frustrating. You might want to consider allowing people to buy classified ads, but not to post anything else. Some hobbyists would like to sell their pets, but not get involved in the postings.

Well, that is one of the major benefits of the new classifieds system I have introduced. All ads expire automatically after a period of time set by the seller. The forum based ads don't do that, well, because this is a forum based message system, and that capability just does not exist here without custom programming. I'm still waiting and evaluating the acceptance of the new classifieds system. I really don't want to just pull the rug out from under people, because LOTS of people just get used to the "old" way and are reluctant to change. So Im hoping that I will be able to determine which system people like best once enough time has passed and the opportunity to try both has been sufficient.

Rich, I realize this site is a lot of work for you and that it is a PRIVILEGE. Not only is it the expenses, the time dedicated is valuable also. I have no problems paying a membership fee, even though I am a casual user.

Thank you. I really would be disappointed in everyone if I found that my efforts here are worthless to the majority of people. I have accepted the fact that that is the signal I may get, however. If this "vote of confidence" goes against me, then that will be that. This site will exist only long enough to fullfill the committments already made for banner ads and memberships. And I will accept the fact that I tried to do the best I can, but it just wasn't good enough for most people.

Now you will have a new headache. Will you send out courtesy reminders when it is time to renew our memberships? Without it, I might get blacklisted!

No. One reason I was able to implement this plan now is because this system does the renewals automatically. Well, as long as you keep your email address current, anyway. You should get a notification several days before expiration reminding you to renew your membership. But even so, you wouldn't be "blacklisted". You would just lose your paid membership status and the functions tied to it, until you renewed.

My last bit of input is, please members, share your wealth of knowledge and post in the discussion forums. So much energy is used on the BOI, but not in the discussions. I got so frustrated trying to get help or discussions going, that I gave up. Not all of us are retailers, we are hobbyists that need help or would just like to discuss things. I think allowing minors to the discussions would be great. Young people can present fresh ideas and they need to gain experience from the best influences possible.

Thanks for hearing me out,
Candy King

Amen!

 

[WebSlave]

I never said I don't post on the BOI - just that it has not saved me any money.


Adrian

That's understandable. And I expect a lot of people will feel the same way. I don't have a problem with that at all. If anyone thinks I have illusions of making a living off of charging $10 a pop, they have a very low standard of acceptable living conditions.

If you don't want nor need the functions that the paid memberships will give you, then you don't need to pay it. There is still going to be a heck of a lot here for free that should be able to keep you occupied.

I think that MANY people have no really earth shattering need to post on the BOI anyway, but do so just because they can and have nothing better to do at the moment. I don't think the greater majority of that is going to be missed at all.

 

[Glenn Bartley]

Rich,

One reason I was able to implement this plan now is because this system does the renewals automatically. Well, as long as you keep your email address current, anyway. You should get a notification several days before expiration reminding you to renew your membership.

Did I miss something, like the fact that the pay for use system has been implemented already? I came into the site tonight, the way I often do, by going to the link in an email saying someone had responded to a post to which I am subscribed. When I read the above it gave me the impression that the pay for use fee schedule already has been implemented, is that correct?

All the best,
GB

 

[mercedesherp]

I may not post often, but I do read much of what goes on here. Some threads are totally rediculous and never quite answer the original question.I am sure that the BOI has saved me money and problems by informing me of someones potential character and mannerisims. When it come to dealing with individuals this site is invalueble. Part time herpers may not understand a fee, but us hardcore guys like to know everything and are willing to pay. I don't think paying $XX.00 per year to utilize this site will deter anyone, other than the casual purchaser of one or two items per year.

 

[Glenn Bartley]

Part time herpers may not understand a fee, but us hardcore guys like to know everything and are willing to pay. I don't think paying $XX.00 per year to utilize this site will deter anyone, other than the casual purchaser of one or two items per year.

It is a shame that the purchaser of one or two animals per year possibly will be deterred from leaving a post on the BOI to drop a dime about a rat dealer especially in light of the original purpose of the BOI. It is also a shame that someone would be willing to allow such people, to whom you refer as 'Part Time Herpers' to become deterred. You see those same people who make small purchases today when they start out are often the same people who become the "hardcore guys" of the future! This is, in my opinion, basically a really big problem with the whole BOI fee thing. The more people who are deterred in such a manner, will be the more people who will see the BOI as a clique for paying members only. This may seem like a drop in the bucket now, but the bucket may become full and overflow much sooner than anticipated. I guess only time will tell if a fee to post on the BOI is a good thing and, I truly hope it works out well but, I do have very strong reservations about such a thing being implemented for the BOI as I fear it will lead to the downfall of one of the most useful herp related tools I have ever seen.

All the best,
GB

 

[WebSlave]

Rich,


Did I miss something, like the fact that the pay for use system has been implemented already? I came into the site tonight, the way I often do, by going to the link in an email saying someone had responded to a post to which I am subscribed. When I read the above it gave me the impression that the pay for use fee schedule already has been implemented, is that correct?

All the best,
GB

Nope, not yet. Not until this weekend when I hopefully have everything set up.

I guess only time will tell if a fee to post on the BOI is a good thing and, I truly hope it works out well but, I do have very strong reservations about such a thing being implemented for the BOI as I fear it will lead to the downfall of one of the most useful herp related tools I have ever seen.

I guess that quote baffles me. Why could something so "useful" to people only be so if it has no value attached to it? What of value, or usefullness, are people getting out of it that is not worth the value of a small payment to keep it all afloat put back into it?

But heck, I am just repeating myself here because I keep trying to answer repeat statements or questions. If anyone has something new to ask that has not already been addresses, please feel free to ask. Otherwise, I do have a lot of work to do.

Thanks for all of the input. Even the negative comments have been instructive to me.

 

[mycurlylocks]

Thanks Rich for allowing us to provide input. Since it is YOUR site, I think it was very good of you to ask us. Most webmasters just make changes and say "Here it is!"
Good luck with your work.
Candy King

 

[Glenn Bartley]

Rich,

You seem to be saying that for something to have a value to it, it must necessarily be of monetary nature. The BOI's best value for your site is the fact that it draws the most users among all of your forums and, that is when it has been free. Sure it may continue to do so once you start charging for people to post in it, then again maybe it will not, maybe it will take a nose dive. Who knows how it will turn out when people have to pay for it. The shame of it is that you are taking a chance that could potentially lead to its downfall y charging for it and, all you can see is that people should pay for it if it has value. One of the BOI's biggest draws was that anyone who registered could use it. That will soon change. Maybe you are missing the true value to be gained from it, even monetarily, by keeping it totally free. If you cannot inderstand a freebie used as an inducement that leads to making money from other aspects of the business then I am the one who is baffled. Offering only art of the BOI as a freebie seems prone to failure but as I said before; I truly hope not.

As for repetition of points made past, well all I can say is I repeat my point again and again hopefully so that it will knock loud enough, maybe in a different tone, at least once to make a difference. I do that because I rather enjoy this site and give a hoot (or should that be a hiss) about it and. because I truly believe you are about to make a mistake that I hope would not be made. As Isaid though, I guess time will tell. Good luck.

All the best,
GB

 

[riverjop]

Glenn, I think what Rich is saying is that it cannot continue as-is! If it makes it great if it dosen't than OH-well ...he tryed! just my observation.

 

[critical bill]

I did it!!

I just became a contributing member and I couldnt feel happier supporting such an essential tool to this trade!

I GOT COINS!!! I GOT COINS!!! I GOT COINS!!!

Best,

Chuck Kimmel

 

[WebSlave]

OK, here's the deal. If my paid membership plan fails and I finally come to that conclusion, what I will do is to close down all of the membership plans and stop accepting any advertising that will extend past 1 year from the date I decide that the plan has busted and the site has flushed down the toilet.

And I will post a notice to that effect on this site with an apology, so there will be no mistake about what has transpired.

Along with that apology, I will post my cell phone number for anyone who cares to call me and tell me "I told you so!" while I am laying on the beach enjoying all of my newly found free time.

Is that fair enough?

 

[Gary O]

tahiti is nice all year round.